My boyfriend has untreated ADD/ADHD and his coping mechanism for disappointing me is avoiding me/being rude. He started a new job where he has to work overtime every day, and he has been rude and condescending when I try to plan anything. We had an appointment to have our cat's stitches out on Saturday morning, which he agreed to go to. Our cat is hard to handle and I don't have a car, so I needed help. He tends to have "no control" over when he falls asleep at night; he had agreed to come over Friday night. By 7:30pm he still hadn't left the office but said he was leaving soon. I didn't hear from him after that, and then I didn't hear from him all weekend. He lives at home with his parents. I asked him not to stop at home first (which is further from his job than my place anyway), but apparently that's what he did without communicating with me. He had said earlier in the day that his mom was coming home and his stuff was "a mess" at the house. He probably went about his business and went to the bachelor party that he had been invited to on Saturday. This morning I texted him and asked if there was any particular reason why he wasn't talking to me. His response: 'I've been busy." I said so have I; you didn't tell me you weren't coming to the cat appointment. He said "I couldn't get up." Well he gets up for work every other day because he has to. No apology, no nothing. All he had to do was show up at my place sometime on Friday night and pass out. That's it. Not only did he not do that, he acts like he is too busy to communicate with me or apologize. It's one thing if he has trouble managing his time and his life, but he has no sense of how to communicate with someone when he over-commits or lets them down. Why should I be understanding of someone who is so disrespectful and rude? Why am I still in this?
I think I'm done
Submitted by crossingfingers... on 05/12/2014.
Why are ANY of us still in this?!?!
Submitted by I'm So Exhausted on
crossingfingers,
Wish I had something encouraging to say. I do understand. It is frustrating.
Trying to understand how our partner's brain works is so hard. Back in our dating days, I never really thought my spouse was rude. I guess my self-esteem was in the pit because when he was late or didn't show up, I always excused his behavior. He obviously had something to do that was more important than me, so who was I to complain.
It was a conundrum even back then. Now I do see clearly that his ADHD brain messed with his social skills. That is not an excuse by any means. I know he had the deficit of growing up without understand how he thought. My son, who is also ADHD, has benefited from lots of advances in understanding ADHD. He has learned social skills, apologizes when he forgets, and lets people know certain things about himself - such as he does NOT answer his phone when he is working. Not for his Mom, nor Dad, nor Sister, and not even his girlfriend. Answering the phone is the biggest distraction there is for him - gets him off track and disrupts what he is doing.
Leave him a message, and he'll call you back. LOL, this REALLY ticks off his sister. She thinks it's rude. I think it is unfair for her to expect him to do something that disrupts his brain process. Especially since he makes it clear he will not answer the phone during - - but will call back later.
I have no way of knowing how my spouse's responses would have changed if I made it clear, way back when, that no indeed, it was NOT acceptable to show up 2 hours late, in your dirty work clothes, and nonchalantly say, "My job today took too long so I don't feel like going out to dinner." Maybe nothing would have changed. but who knows.
I always said he lacked common sense. He certainly lacks the same common sense I have!
Good question!
Submitted by crossingfingers... on
Hi I'm So Exhausted,
That is great that your son has the insight into himself to set reasonable expectations that he can stick to. At least he does what he says he will, even if the method doesn't please everyone. It sounds like he has benefited from what you and your partner have learned over time, as well as thoughtful parenting.
I wish my boyfriend could set reasonable expectations for himself instead of trying to please everyone, getting overwhelmed, and then treating me like I have to constantly be the one that gets let down. It would be a lot easier to be understanding of him if he wasn't so inconsiderate and un-accepting of his own mistakes and limitations in a way that drags out negativity and stonewalling for days. I'm not sure I can give him the kind of slack he is asking for if it means he gets to keep disrespecting me. I also can't be responsible for creating a solution for him so that he treats people better. (He got kicked out of his band after not responding to a call from the singer for days. His rationalization is that this is not the first time it has happened to him, therefore it is not his fault.) One of my friends is very interested in his girlfriend's happiness, and it gave me pause. I thought, wow, if only I was in a relationship like that! I think I want everything I have invested in this to be worthwhile, but I am starting to realize that it isn't just up to me.
Another insight
Submitted by I'm So Exhausted on
Cossingfingers,
Another issue your comment brought to mind: My spouse does not take time to celebrate his successes. He keeps adding more detail to projects, and then adds additional projects onto that. Every time he gets near the end of something, he kicks the goal five feet ahead. I am not sure why he does that. Is it because if he doesn't claim a project as finished, he still has time to make adjustments so it can be perfect?
My spouse was hurt terribly by the fact his father was very critical of him and the rest of his siblings. My spouse realized that when we were first dating. I feel bad that he still carries that pain with him. Yes, it was a fact - but i wish he could find a way to forgive his dad - who passed away in 2001 - and move on with his own life. It is a horrible to see him suffer almost daily with that pain. I do not know how to help him.
I try to set boundaries. I know in my head what they are - but how to convey them to my spouse, exactly what words to say when he pushes on one - that is where I get in trouble.
Time to set some boundaries
Submitted by MelissaOrlov on
You need to take a look at yourself and decide what is important to you - my vote is always "being treated with respect" and a few other things that I outline in The ADHD Effect on Marriage, which give a lot more detail about boundaries. In any event, setting boundaries is what you do for YOURSELF so you understand your own limits in what you need in your life to be yourself and happy. For example - "I am worthy of, and deserve respect" might be one of your main rules to live by. If you don't get it from a boyfriend, a girlfriend, your parents - whomever - you either work through it with them so you do, or you move away from that person and on to something else. Certainly when you are dating, a partner should be on very good behavior...if not now, then when?!
So think about what's important to you in your relationships and, once you're able to put it into words well, have a serious talk with this man (if you're still interested in him, that is) and tell him what you seek. He can either be that man, or not. His choice...and, by the way, yours.
How to be firm?
Submitted by crossingfingers... on
Hi Melissa,
Thanks so much for your reply. I am trying to figure out how to set boundaries in a way that garners respect rather than sounding like I am bargaining. Can you suggest some sample sentences I could use? I will have a serious talk with him about what I want, but I'm not sure how to articulate it so that he understands how serious I am. I have told him what I need many times before and for some reason he still thinks he can treat me this way when he is having trouble handling his life. I know it's not just me that is affected by how he is; he was recently kicked out of his band and got in trouble at work. But he tells me things like he is tired of "hearing" about how I feel after he avoids communicating, and that I don't cut him enough slack when he is tired. I'm not sure why he talks like he is the center of the universe.
Yesterday his brother had a graduation and his cousin had an engagement party, and months ago he led me to believe I would be invited to both. I asked him to confirm it weeks ago, and he "wanted to call me" but "fell asleep" on Friday. I said "well you didn't call me this morning to tell me either" (Saturday) and he told me I don't cut him enough slack for being exhausted. Turns out I wasn't invited to either, and then he didn't want to hear that I thought he handled it wrong. He also made the excuse that he "just found out" that I wasn't invited, even though he is the one who procrastinated. After the cat incident last week I told him that I won't tolerate him shutting down communication or being disrespectful, and it seems to have had no effect. He was nice to me for a couple of days and then when he thinks I am criticizing him, he rejects me. I know that he cares about me; it seems like he gets blinders on when he is overwhelmed and just avoids me. He also has trouble taking personal responsibility for what is in his control and determining what isn't. He has no idea how to care for my feelings when he is responsible for hurting them because he hates feeling blamed. I am ready to set boundaries and move on if he doesn't meet them, but I'm not sure how to get out of the cycle of his excuses so I can actually make a decision.
BEing firm...and boundaries
Submitted by MelissaOrlov on
So the boundaries are for YOU, not for him. (Read the chapter on this in The ADHD Effect on Marriage.) You can't dictate his behavior with a set of rules. Instead, you must decide what it is that is most important to you, and then live your life according to those ideas (perhaps "values" would be a better word than boundaries?) In any event, think carefully about this in a conceptual way - i.e. "I want him to do the laundry" or "I want him to tell me whether or not I'm invited to graduation" are not boundary ideas in themselves. On the other hand, "I wish to be respected by others, as I will respect others" is a boundary idea.
Once you've figured out a couple of these critical, conceptual, overarching ideas...then you start to live by them. So your behavior towards him would always be respectful, no matter what. And you would let him know that he must be respectful of you, too, otherwise the relationship will not be aligned with one of your most important values. This does not mean he won't get angry once in a while, or irritated. But it does mean that when he does he understands that this isn't respectful, and at some point apologizes and tries to do better...because it's the right way to be with you. It is the essence of who you are and what you need.
There may be a learning period while the two of you adjust...
One of the issues about respecting him would be that you try to figure out what makes him tick...so you write "it seems like he gets blinders on when he is overwhelmed and just avoids me..." Yes, people with ADHD do have this issue more than is convenient - it's part of their ADHD, often, that they get overwhelmed easily. You can both address this together by respecting that this is something he must deal with and talk together about whether "avoiding you" is the right response. Another might be to create a verbal cue where he tells you he's getting overwhelmed, and then you are able to remain calm...or give him a few minutes to get calm...or approach the topic a new way...or
You also make another interesting comment about his feeling blamed...it could be that he is hyper-defensive...or it could be that you are actually blaming him, rather than seeking mutually useful solutions, or a combination of both (this is the most likely scenario...) For example, one way to deal with the grad invite is to simply set a date that you must know by...else you won't be able to go. Or, perhaps, to make the contact yourself (it is you, afterall, who is trying to figure out the logistics)...etc. By letting too much time pass you increase the pressure on him to perform within a certain timeframe...but I'm guessing he doesn't have good support structures in place, so it's a recipe for disaster for him.
As you can see, this is all complex, but in any event, think of boundaries not as rules for him, but as rules that you put in place so that YOU can live by them.
Thanks!
Submitted by crossingfingers... on
Thanks, that is very helpful. I did try to say to him last week, "since I haven't heard by today, it looks like I'm not going to the graduation" and he kept saying he would find out and let me know. I should have stuck to my guns. He also had led me to believe I was going to the engagement party and then didn't tell me otherwise until the last possible moment. He did something like this at work too, where he put off preparing for a hearing and it had to be re-assigned to another attorney. Instead of trying to find a solution or deal with disappointing someone, he waits until there is nothing to be done and then doesn't accept responsibility. We have had numerous discussions about not avoiding me, and it seems like he can't help going back to it as a coping mechanism for stress.
I think the hardest part about setting boundaries will be accepting that our relationship will probably suffer when I stop overcompensating for what he doesn't do. One boundary I could set could be that I won't always be the one to make plans; he has told me before that he isn't the kind of person that makes plans, that he just responds to other people (this includes his friendships). I used to be the one to initiate plans because he gets distracted or is not good at planning, etc., and because he says yes to almost everything people suggest to him, so I felt like I had to make plans. As you said, I can't change his behavior, so I guess he will realize that he needs to reciprocate more if he wants to see me. In the meantime I won't be doing more than my half and his behavior can stand on its own. I have tried to pull back on this before, but we end up falling into the same pattern. I do need to set these boundaries for myself though, you are right.
Another difficulty that I have experienced is that even when I have been respectful to him, I don't always get respect back. He makes up a justification for getting mad and being rude, and that's that as far as he's concerned. I think he has actually started to use the relationship as a channel for his stress because I probably have accepted too much. I have made a concerted effort to change my reactions to things, but he still is looking for conflict. One time recently I didn't text him much when he was out with friends, and the next day he got mad because I didn't make a big deal out of it. He made assumptions about what I was thinking about him being out instead of asking me, and then got mad at me about it! I remained calm and repeated that I trusted him, and he still yelled at me because he thought I had certain feelings. Even if I had certain feelings (i.e., his friends are immature), I kept them to myself; why should he get mad at me for having them? I was respectful in my words and actions towards him.
I have been waiting to buy your book because he hasn't accepted his ADHD, but it sounds like I would benefit from reading it if I am choosing to stay in this relationship. Thanks for your thoughtful advice!
Stopping Overcompensating
Submitted by MelissaOrlov on
Yes - once you set boundaries for yourself you tend not to overcompensate. Other good reading for you would be "Codependent No More" by Melodie Beatty. There is a period of adjustment when you are looking for things to fill the void - you stop doing his stuff for him...what happens next? Ideally you work with him to fill in that void with positive interactions - making it safe fro him to come to you if he's behind on something, etc. In addition, you'll be doing a lot of explaining to him about your new ways for a while.
In my opinion there are basic, bottom line aspects to any healthy relationship and when you go below those, there are NO excuses. So his saying "it's okay to be rude" is actually not right. Anger, rudeness, etc are NOT excused by another's behavior. Whether he was angry with you or not, HE is still the one who is responsible for contributing his "best self" to your relationship. Blaming someone else is a cop out. There is no justification to be found just because of other people's actions. When you look from outside your relationship as a third party and evaluate your own behavior, you should be able to be proud of it. If you aren't, then it's time for a change.
Sad but true
Submitted by crossingfingers... on
Hi I-have-adhd,
I really needed to hear what you said in your post even though it makes me sad. Thanks for your kind words, I don't think I deserve it either. It really does become hard to tell what is the inability to cope and what is him being a jerk. He already hasn't spoken to me in a day (I explain it in my response to Melissa above), and the irony is it's over a situation that he isn't taking responsibility for. Lately I have realized how full of excuses he is and how poor his self-perception is. I don't know why he thinks he deserves "slack" because he is overwhelmed by work and that I should put up with this kind of treatment.
I would like to give him an ultimatum but I'm not sure how to do that successfully or without sounding threatening. I feel taken for granted but I'm afraid I would sound desperate if I gave him an ultimatum. Maybe I should make one for myself though, but it's hard. Whenever I pull back to see if he will pursue me again, it happens for a bit and we fall back into the cycle where I am always the one having to compromise.
I don't want to assume our
Submitted by ICanSeeClearlyNow on
I don't want to assume our situations are the same, but things about your boyfriend sound eerily familiar to my husband...and it's things I'm not sure have anything to do with ADHD (I'm still trying to put my husband's behaviours into what is ADHD and what is not). Anyway, my husband also used to shut down and turn the tables on me when he was stressed when we were dating - he broke up with me at least 2 times during report card writing periods (we're both teachers). He was there for me a lot more than it sounds like your boyfriend is (we were dating during one of the worst health crises of my life and he was caring and supportive for the most part), but I definitely ended up compromising a lot when we did get married (over where we lived for example) - a friend told me I needed to be careful that if I compromised any more I'd collapse. Well, fast forward to four years into married life and two kids and things are really tough. I'm wondering now if I were where you were now, and someone told me kids would multiply our stress and problems by 10, if I'd have made a different decision.
As for the ultimatum - I'm there myself with my husband and having a lot of trouble on how to phrase things and even finding the courage to do it. I'll basically have to take the kids away from him if he doesn't agree to go to counselling with me which is the bare minimum I need right now - and I just don't know how to do that (and don't want to).
Good luck with whatever decision you make, but do realize that things only get harder when dating turns to marriage and marriage turns to raising kids.
Sounds similar to me
Submitted by crossingfingers... on
Our situations do sound similar, and I am starting to realize that whether it's an ADHD behavior or not, there are things he could do to work on it. Recently I feel like he has been turning against me if I react to something in a way he doesn't want me to (e.g., instead of being super appreciative that he was thinking of me, I said "why on earth would I do that" when he suggested I move somewhere where there are numerous things that are deal-breakers for me moving. I should have stopped and rephrased but he texted me late at night, and that was my first reaction.) I was in disbelief and asked if he had been listening to anything I said I was looking for regarding an apt., and if he actually thought I should move in with a stranger and a dog when I have two cats. He proceeded to call me a jerk and said he doesn't like the way I talk to him (ironic, huh?). He tells me my reactions determine whether he regrets doing something or not.
Another situation that happened recently was I was out with a friend near my apartment on a Friday having a great time and he called me at 8:30. He said we were invited to a "bonfire" at his friend's house 45 min away. I told him I would come but I wasn't going to just walk away from my friend when we were already in the middle of plans. For once in my life I wasn't staring at the clock worrying about pleasing him, I didn't drop what I was doing, and I went over the estimated timeline I gave him. He chose to be passive-aggressively mad instead of politely saying something like "hey did you realize it's a half hour after you said you'd be back." He does this all of the time with me (doesn't consider my time), and the one time it happened to him he was rude and pushy. I said that he should be understanding because he claims to lose track of time all the time and is often late to see me. He didn't like that and decided that he was the one who had the right to be angry. We had a wedding to attend the next day, and two hours before he was saying he might want to break up. I was like, I am not doing this now, can you try to find some understanding in your heart? And then he wouldn't stop telling me how pretty I was, etc., all night. To me this is a really volatile and almost crazy way to be.
The emotional compromising that I do, which sounds similar to what you do, is really tiring. I don't understand why he is so emotionally volatile. When things are great they are really great, but otherwise I feel like I am walking on eggshells and subject to his moods. Thank you for sharing your story. I am definitely not rushing into marriage or kids.
Because you keep believing
Submitted by LyraHeartstrings on
Because you keep believing that things will change and they won't. That's probably why most of us are still in it. Please realize there are so many lovely people in the world that you don't need to settle for anyone who isn't going to give you just basic respect. Please get at least that for yourself.
I understand "Done"
Submitted by RosaD on
Hi. I have been married 24 years to a man with ADD. Let me tell you....marriage is very difficult as it is. Adding ADD to the equation is nearly impossible. The thing you have going for you is, you arn't married. Find someone without ADD ADHD. You found out early. Be glad. You won't have to deal with the never ending loneliness of the distracted spouse. Or your bills not getting paid because the ADD spouse doesn't pay them. Or the unhappiness of your children because your ADD spouse is, again, distracted. Or try this one...your ADD spouse doesn't need your affection because he can get all the affection he needs just by petting the dogs.
I realize I am not painting a very "cherry blossom' picture for you. Understand...living with a spouse with ADD will bring out the loneliest, most frustrated, most angry emotions you will ever experience. I wish someone had told me more about ADD. Then when you see it impacting your children...I feel guilty because I chose my son's father.
Please find yourself a boyfriend without ADD/ADHD!! You deserve it!
Lonely, frustrated, and the
Submitted by lauren07 on
Lonely, frustrated, and the most angry......you nailed it. I am so bitter, and I LEFT!
Good advice!!
Good for you!!!
Submitted by RosaD on
Lauren,
I wish you all the best!!!
Reciprocal communication
Submitted by crossingfingers... on
Hi Rosa and Lauren,
Thanks for your honest comments. Something that I realized today is that he has no sense of other people's expectations/feelings when it comes to reciprocal communication. He communicates when he wants to and resents people for getting upset that hours or days can go by without a response. He calls me and others overbearing because we don't like it. This generates a lot of anger and loneliness in me, which you were mentioning above. I think those of us who are still in it are in it because we love the other person, but we get angry because we also love ourselves and need reciprocity. My bf sits on his high horse and avoids me, and accuses me of being a way I am not (flipping out if I don't get my way). His brother who has Aspergers is like that, and it's like my bf can't understand anything else and that other people have different feelings and personalities. It's hard because things will be great but then I remember that it's always on his terms. He feels like mutual communication is like having to report to someone. He is really charming with people whom he has no responsibility to. We play this game where he will ignore me until he feels less stressed out, and then things are on his terms again. I'm not sure how he can't see that his lack of empathy in his relationships is the common denominator, and that his inconsistency drives people's questioning. It is so ironic that he thinks things have to be on my terms when it's exactly the reverse, and that he gets mad for making him feel bad so in turn makes me feel bad. I don't get it. And it's just very sad because I think all of his relationships suffer from this lack of empathy. I think I am afraid to let go because I don't want to lose all of the good things.
I have to add
Submitted by crossingfingers... on
I have to add something he said today. I said to him "I'm just going by what you told me," and he said, "No, you're going by what you think about what I told you." Could I go by anything else?? Is this familiar to anyone?
is he worth it?
Submitted by mariel on
I think you just have to decide if he's worth the effort. Is he open to thinking about how this affects you and willing to consider trying to change? Are you worth him changing for? and if so then do you want that responsibility? If not then it's probably not going to get better and to get worse if you have kids. However each person is an individual and I believe capable of change. As the wife of an ADHD man and mother of an ADHD bloke I am cut to the core by comments above like "find someone without adhd". Like everyone without adhd is automatically better than everyone with it? Just who are we comparing these men to? All those perfect guys out there with no faults? Life with my husband is hard. but for us it's worth it - for now anyway. many other people on this site have chosen to end their marriages and I would say that's the right choice for them.
If you want to make it work with him then it's no good having some kind of typical expectations and just being ( not sure that would work with anyone) you and him have to recognise each other's way of being and work to make it easier. For example I recognise in when you said; "He does this all of the time with me (doesn't consider my time), and the one time it happened to him he was rude and pushy. I said that he should be understanding because he claims to lose track of time all the time and is often late to see me. " a cycle I would get in with my husband - he does really annoying things then complains about someone else ( me maybe) doing something only half as bad or half as frequently. . . . and I would go "well you should understand because you....." It's a completely natural reaction but it's no good. first off if I'm saying that turning up half an hour late is wrong then it's still wrong even if it's me doing it. Him doing it more doesn't make it right for me to do it, second of all if I want hime to be apologetic and not defensive and angry when he does something wrong then I need to model that myself. Thirdly if he's stresed out about something then me essentially bringing up one or more of his failings is not going to improve things. What could possibly come form me saying "you should understand, you do...."? What am I thinking? that he will go "Oh yes, you're right, now I see how annoying my behaviour must have been in the past I forgive you for your lapse and I promise to try harder" :-) My advice for what it is worth would be talk to him - don't put him on the spot, maybe write him a letter setting out your concerns, hopes and asking to schedule a discussion. Think hard about what you want and what you are prepared to compromise on. Don't compare him to anyone else real or imagined as another alternative - there might not be someone else out there, there might be someone 'better' (who turns out not to be) or 'worse' but you can only consider what is. Consider the merits and drawbacks of this relationship with this man, try to envision it played forward realistically into the future. Set yourself a deadline for making a decision. Good luck. m x
Okay, NOBODY is worth this
Submitted by dvance on
Okay, NOBODY is worth this much effort. If you are not yet married to an ADD person, run don't walk away. Whoever said a lifetime of loneliness--bingo!!! Everything in the world is more interesting then the tedium of marriage and family. Don't get me wrong--I love taking care of my kids-I am happy to keep a clean house, make nice meals, do laundry (maybe not happy every single moment!!!!!!!) because I want to live in a clean house and have nice meals and have clean clothes and I want my kids to feel secure and well taken care of and have the expectation of all of those things. But none of it is terribly glamorous or interesting. And therein lies the rub--an ADD person is like a monkey after a shiny object--whatever grabs them in the moment for however long it lasts and then on to the next thing. My ADD husband got all fired up over the winter about making different kinds of lamps to put in local art shows (he is a big crafty/fix-it guy). He bought all the supplies, put all the dates in his calendar, asked a friend to use some space in his basement to work on them (we live in an apartment), and then...nothing. That was the extent of it. He did a side job (unemployed right now) emptying out and repairing a garage space that a friend of his bought. He brought home all these "great finds" (AKA junk)--old skiis, old bird cages, wooden wine crates, a Budwiser mirror that is as tall as I am--crap. He was all fired up to clean the stuff up and sell it at some of the antique stores by us. That was in February. The stuff is still in our building garage space--looks terrible--we are the only people with crap around our cars in the building garage. We are hanging by a thread because of his unemployment, but he took the big change jar that we keep and turned it all in to buy storage bins for the tools in his car that he uses for side jobs. They were on sale at Home Depot, so gotta have them NOW. There was $240 in that change jar. He turned it in three weeks ago, bought the bins, which only cost half of that-don't know where the other half went, and the bins are sitting in our storage locker with tons of other organizing systems that he just HAD to have over the years. And the storage locker is so full of crap that you can't get in it--looks like one of those lockers on Storage Wars. In our closet is a big collection of "silver" that he has found--don't know where, but there is a "silver" bowl, some forks, candlesticks--again, crap. Again, all fired up to clean it and sell it. To whom??? It's garbage that no one wants--that's why he found most of it in the garbage!!!!!
Again I say--if you are not yet saddled with an ADD person--run don't walk while you still can. It will suck your will to live. I hate the person I am now. I have been living like this for 19 years. Our youngest will go to college in five--he's going into 8th grade in the fall--and then I am DONE. FREE. Never again to be a parent to an adult who was supposed to be an equal and yet could never quite get it together. My guy used to be medicated and he was exactly the same way. Very short sighted, no concept of time. He has no idea how slow and inefficient he is. I watch him do things and I just want to scream--get it done already. He will call me at noon from a side job and say he is cleaning up and not walk in the house until 9pm. What went on in all that time? No idea. He doesn't offer and it happens so often, I don't even ask any more. I am at the point where the boys and I do our thing and hubby comes and goes as he pleases. Much less stressful to have no expectations. I have a family calendar posted in the kitchen with all the relevant stuff on it--the kids even know to post their stuff. I will watch him standing there looking at it and 20 minutes later he will ask me something about some plans that are clearly posted. Not a huge deal once or twice, but all the time. A therapist we used to go to asked him why he doesn't take a picture of it with his phone or plug in everything that pertains to him the first day of each month (I am really good about having that calendar up to date each month--it's a white board one). Hubby said he didn't know, he just doesn't do that. Okay, WHY?? I just don't understand--if you know you have weaknesses, why not use the tools available to you to compensate? I use the alarms and calendar on my phone religiously and I don't have ADD. I am training my sons to do that too--set the alarm 15 minutes before something has to happen to give yourself time, pack your bag the night before--basic life skills. We have been in more counseling than I care to remember and it never sticks. Why? Because that stuff is boring and repetitive. That's what I think.
Both of my kids have ADHD and I am training them in these life skills. Will they stick? I have no idea but I can tell you the older one will be a TERRIBLE husband (he's 15). He has no ability to plan ahead and gets downright surly when I impose it on him. Everything is last minute (if he had his way), he gets an idea in his head and cannot let it go. He's also an A student, on the swim team and water polo team, has a part time job--it's not all bad news with him, but there are some ADD behaviors that I just don't think are compatible with marriage UNLESS the ADD person themselves wants to change and that is pretty gosh darn rare.
I agree with your first
Submitted by lauren07 on
I agree with your first sentence and many of your others. I saw my future, begged for change from him, diagnosed his ADD even, and then promptly left him and moved on as best I could. Problem is, I'm tied to him for life because of our child. Honestly, he has a big, loving heart, but the ADD symptoms were too much to bear. If you love your family, but consistently $&@# on them, it's hard to feel loved. It doesn't matter how much you love your child if you can't be trusted with them. Trusted with their life, trusted with their feelings, trusted to get them to appointments/meetings...... I can't trust mine with any of this and more.
"Never again to be a parent to an adult who was supposed to be an equal and yet could never quite get it together."
Agreed! Even after I left, I felt like his parent. When he moved to my state to try to make it there, I realized I'd be his parent there for sure. I'm glad he's back with his real Mom. This woman was never mad at me for leaving and she's a tough lady. I guess she knew a divorce was highly likely and respects my decision to leave. I'm moving much closer to them to see if we can co-parent better there. If it doesn't work, I have a couple nice places to move back to. While my child is young, I want help. Help from him or at least his family. My child needs me to at least try. My husband has been very supportive, but I'm so bitter that I can barely stand to be around him.
"Much less stressful to have no expectations."
Yep!! After a minor emotional breakdown from letting him live with me for a month or so, I told mine to his face that the only way I can live with him is to have no expectations of him. He silently agreed, then announced a few hours later that he was moving back to his parents, 20 hours away! He had just spent 6 months far way from his kid, yet off he goes in the other direction a mere 3 months later. A few days later, he's crying again about missing his child. F'ing crazy!
"I have a family calendar posted in the kitchen with all the relevant stuff on it--the kids even know to post their stuff. I will watch him standing there looking at it and 20 minutes later he will ask me something about some plans that are clearly posted. Not a huge deal once or twice, but all the time. A therapist we used to go to asked him why he doesn't take a picture of it with his phone or plug in everything that pertains to him the first day of each month (I am really good about having that calendar up to date each month--it's a white board one). Hubby said he didn't know, he just doesn't do that. Okay, WHY?? I just don't understand--if you know you have weaknesses, why not use the tools available to you to compensate? I use the alarms and calendar on my phone religiously and I don't have ADD."
ALL OF THIS OMG!!! I don't understand either!!! He about drives me insane with his poor, poor memory. His seeming inability at reading comprehension. I will read something over and over until I comprehend it. He will skim something for major points and run with it. You simply can not be successful doing that!!! Duh!! I keep appts and notes on my phone AND a written calendar. I rarely forget things because of this. He won't do any of that. It's highly frustrating, but he DOESN'T GET IT!! Just expects easy forgiveness for constantly dropping the ball. For someone that constantly cries about missing his child when he's away, he never spends quality time with him when they ARE together. He spent his last day at my house NOT PACKING and I had to pick our kid up from daycare at 6pm. He spent that night packing. I feel like I want to take a 2x4 and literally beat some sense into him. His ONE daily job was the kid's bath. Bath by 8pm? Forget it! He won't get up til I run the water myselff. If he's not supervised or constantly reminded, body parts don't even get washed. But he always has an excuse.....oh it was just a quick bath, not, I completely forgot to wash his super dirty face. Uggh!!! The man has an excuse even when he's caught red-handed. I left water spots on the windshield? Not my fault! It was the hard water. He still left spots after the re-do. Not my fault!!! I couldn't find my tool....a dang hand squee-gee. Are you freaking kidding me? He cross-threaded the oil filter on my car. Not my fault Firestone's 300 lb guy can't get it off. He's just not trying hard enough. No, dip, if he tried harder, he risks breaking the entire oil pan. I changed oil on my Honda for years and NEVER cross-threaded a filter. It takes real carelessness to do that. The dumb crap this man has done still confounds me. I WANT him to find a new woman to bear some of this burden. I told him if he found a woman that I liked, I'd force feed him the ADD pills and drive him to therapy lol.
Uggh!!! I hope I can stomach the few months of hell of us living together while I get situated in my new city. As soon as it gets too hard, his butt is GONE!! If he and his family don't make this move worth my while, I'M GONE!!
my husband is worth it
Submitted by mariel on
You don't know my husband. I don't question your judgement of your husband as I don't know him. Please don't write your son off, he's still a child and from what you say he is doing better than lots of non adhd 15 year olds. Maybe he will meet someone or have a life where planning ahead is not needed? or you know, grow and develop as he grows up?
Oh I am not writing my son
Submitted by dvance on
Oh I am not writing my son off--he is a terrific young man--good student, job, swim team + water polo--I know he does really well for himself but it has been a LOT of work to get him to this point and continues to be. That is work I am absolutely willing to do because he is my kid and I am prepared to parent him however he is AND I actually see growth and change and the ability to learn from one situation to the next. I see no ability to grow and change and learn from one situation to the next in my husband, age 46. And I did not sign up to be my husband's parent. If and when my son is ready to get married, I hope he is able to get control over some of those behaviors because a lot of them are not going to be welcomed in a normal healthy relationship and in fact will probably cause a spouse a fair amount of heartache and frustration.
And to all of you...
Submitted by Resigned2B on
I'm at the end of this ADHD story while you all seem to be in the middle.
My youngest ADDer son is 24. And no, it doesn't change. All the 'skills' you have and are working so hard to teach them? They ALL seems to disappear once you and the stickers and the charts and the calendars are gone. Someone on this thread said once regarding her son, 'Have your clothes MET your closet!?!' And the answer I have come to know, after six kids and an ADHD husband is, NO, they haven't met. And, they will likely NEVER meet.
Run don't walk is advice I needed thirty years ago. Even 15 years ago. Now at nearly 60, I can barely run OR walk! To say nothing of having no money since he's spent it ALL behind my back. As in ZERO for our retirement! I just found that out three months ago. This particular type of lie is a gift that 'keeps on giving'. It is NEVER over. Just two days ago even MORE financial lies came out. Not because he 'volunteered' the truth. But, as any good 'mother' I CAUGHT him! This new lie hits our already tattered paycheck at minus $1,500 a MONTH!
I'd like to come to this site and say, "That's IT, I'm DONE" But that begs the question, now what? Walk out the door with the clothes on my back and go to a shelter for the homeless??? I might as well stay and take my chances here...
Our 24 year old son? He lives with us and works while he's going to college. Last night we find out that he's been just 'pretending' to go to school. In fact, he's not even registered. Yet, everyday he goes to work and then comes home and off to his EMT class. For THREE months he has been pulling off this lie. My husband was FURIOUS! I said, hey, don't look at me, YOU have lied to ME about every finance we have, and YOU'VE managed to pull off THAT lie for FOUR YEARS without even BLINKING!!!
They deserve each other! Now I'm left without anyone I can trust. I've filled out my own DNR. Why would anyone care it I make it through a car crash or a heart attack. We all have to get out of this life somehow...
Oh God, please help us all...
Resigned2B, I'm so sorry to
Submitted by PoisonIvy on
Resigned2B, I'm so sorry to hear what you have gone through and are still dealing with. I think lying is bad, and even worse is lying to protect oneself at someone else's expense, as your husband has done, apparently repeatedly. Worst of all is financial infidelity. I hope there is something you can do to survive and get out.
Rosered...
Submitted by Resigned2B on
If you have any suggestions, please post! :{
Creative expectations
Submitted by crossingfingers... on
Hi Mariel,
I have been thinking about your response for a while. You are absolutely right about my expectations--I will have to change them if I am going to be with him, period. And I don't see that as me compromising too much or as things being unfair. He gets upset when I talk about what other people are doing or what I think typical expectations are for communication, relationships, etc. He also is doing nothing to investigate his challenges (is not getting help), so that can be frustrating for me. I think it's about meeting him where he is with how he is, and I'm not always good at that yet. It is a lot harder to try to let go of my expectations than I thought it would be. On the other hand, he exceeds what is "normal" in some great ways. I haven't yet decided if it's worth all of the time and energy and lack of understanding about it on his end.
One of our biggest challenges is still communication, but he is trying. I have to work on letting go of resentment that builds up from when he says I am selfish when I talk about my feelings. I think I have to pretend that my relationship is a creative experiment instead of paying attention to "shoulds" or what other people are doing. Everyone has to change their expectations to some degree in a relationship to accept the way the other person is. I know someone who is so picky that she rarely gets past a second date. Not to say that I suggest settling, but I think I am learning that the relationship is not about how I think he should be, but about learning how the other person is. It sounds basic but I think some people never realize this. Sometimes he doesn't understand how different I feel like he is, but how could he? There are also things about him being different that I love. As I read in another post today, that is the only way he knows how to be. I want to listen more to who he is and less to the expectations in my head and see what happens. Maybe I can embrace the fun things more. Maybe loving him isn't easy, but if I'm not loving him for who he is then what am I doing?
I am so thankful for this site, it is really therapeutic for me today.