My wife and will be married 20 years next week.
The last few years have been rough. I read the book. A lot of it rang true. I'm the one with ADHD.
A bit of marital backstory. We have had a great marriage overall, at least that is what I would have said before truly understanding what she's been living with. A recurring theme has really been around connection. She's wants, I sporadically give it. For the better part of our marriage I was not on meds, and not in therapy. She begged me to do therapy. I went sporadically. It always made me feel incredibly uneasy. I think I always felt that I was misunderstood or that she really was overreacting, or that "these are the little things why is this always such a huge argument", etc. So therapy became this chess game of me trying to get to a place where I could really believe that I was the one at fault, and reporting back to her in a way that would somehow get her past the recent disconnection. I truly didn't understand a lot of the time why I was disconnecting, and I knew in my heart it wasn't out of non-interest in my spouse. I just did. We used to go out for dinner, and after the meal was done and she just wanted to continue to connect and finish her wine, I would want to leave. Sitting still at a table was agony. I felt terrible about this. But I just couldn't hide it. We mostly got past things like this for the most part. The meds help. I've gotten a bit better at some of the things that cause disconnection but I know it is cumulative pain.
But over the years, she has had to manage a lot. 2 kids, one with some very serious ADHD and another with a mild case. She's had to manage me. She's carried 90% of the executive function weight in the house. I saw it sometimes, most of the time I didn't. I do all of the finances, my fair share of work around the house. I have even at times thought I was contributing beyond my fair share, but I enjoy being busy, and it didn't bother me unless she brought up how I again have been ignoring or not participating in some process in the house designed to help all of us. I would often get resentful because I would get scolded for doing something wrong 20% of the time. I didn't see the non-stop mental work she was putting in. I didn't understand how painful it must be to be trying to help someone and they resent you for it.
Things would be ok, then deteriorate as I would get hyper-fixated on some new project etc, and she would hit rock bottom and blow up at me or the kids. I always thought these were indicative of her having a bad temper, or not being able to manage stress or whatever. Or that this was still from some residual anger at me. I understand why now. I hate it.
Over the last few years I have become more reactive. I have been drinking more. Mostly to just not feel like shit that we aren't connected. That doesn't help with reactivity obviously. Being on the outs with her is always a an emotional nightmare for me. I go through waves of resentment, sadness, then wakeup hopeful that things are in my power to fix this, but when I see her look at the kids and laugh and such, then immediately go cold to me, it is really, really hard. It has recently caused me just to avoid her at times because being "shunned" just has become too painful. I have been reading about RSD, not sure if that is something that I might have but I can say when I am stressed about our relationship, it is hard for me to react in ways that take in the perspective of others. I don't have a fear of failure or anything, in fact I'd say overconfidence is more of an issue. But when I am scolded by her it nearly impossible for me to not react.
For a long time I wasn't honest. I lied about therapy. I lied about how I felt. I lied about not being resentful. I felt like if I was truthful she was going to just be even more upset, and I wanted to get back to being in love. I wanted to get it over with. When it was, I just couldn't bring it up to really resolve the underlying issue because I was so afraid not being connected.
The thing is that I WANT to be the one in the wrong. That is so much easier. But it is SO hard for me to see that sometimes.
We went on vacation this past week, and had a very long and hard conversation at dinner where I did fess up to a lot of this. I think it hurt, but I was hopeful that maybe a corner had been turned. She mentioned that she wanted to get a post-nup so she could feel safe in our relationship. Because I never would ever consider about screwing her over in a divorce, I agreed to look into it. We both had drank a bit by that point.
Yesterday she asked about moving forward with it in an email. It sent me into a very dark spiral. I just can't see how working through asset splitting isn't going to make everything way worse. I sent a flurry of emails basically wondering if she even loves me any more, and communicated I am very worried that maybe this is already over. It kills me to think she has been living with similar thoughts for so long. I don't want it to over.
There was an incident last night that was largely driven by the stress of the emails we had exchanged, that put my wife into a bad place and she had a panic attack this morning. I left the house immediately to give her space, and she called and said if I don't sign a post-nup in two weeks she looking for a legal separation. I don't blame her at all. She has gone through too much.
Here is the thing though, I really feel motivated and hopeful that I can now be 100% honest with her about everything, and am excited to start on some additional treatment. I have told her she needs to not be my therapist and that I am the only one that can fix this. I am going to further pursue maybe an SSRI and plan to look into doing some CBT and/or DBT.
The real issue at this point for me is that the post-nup she wants me to sign effectively asks for 80% of our assets and over 50% of my salary. She asked for numbers and said she doesn't trust me not to hide it money. It immediately sent me into tears. I will do anything to save this marriage but I feel like I also need to make sure I am not jeopardizing my future as well and that if we actually start "negotiating" when we are both so raw from breaking things down, it really going to be counterproductive to the healing process.
Comments
Don't sign before getting a legal opinion
I'm really sorry to hear about your situation. I don't know if it's too late or not to salvage your relationship - that really depends on your wife's mindset. But either way, I would highly recommend you get a legal opinion before signing a post-nup. Nothing combative - just a truly fair and honest opinion on what's reasonable and customary in situations like yours. To assure her of your honesty, perhaps you can even go together to get a balanced opinion so both of you can see clearly how the finances might look if you were to split. It's tough out there as a single so you never know... what you hear might even motivate you both to give it one final try together! :)
Yeah, I said I wasn't
Yeah, I said I wasn't comfortable signing it. She did originally say that she wanted to sort of do the in house quite separation thing, which I sort of dismissed because it sounds awful (and still does). And the post-nup was sort of a way of saying to me I need something to know you are going to actually try and treat yourself if you want connection. More of insurance for herself so she could feel safe to be connected again, not as a threat. I told her I'd rather try and do the quiet separation because I think it has a better chance of succeeding. But, right now, she is very angry and hurt, and the idea of walking a healing path together I think is hard for her. I am trying to just keep learning and working toward accountability and behavioral change. Best I can do at this point.
Connection
From reading your post, I spotted ( of pin pointed ) the one thing that would hurt me most in everything you said. You said you'd do just about anything here, so if it were me, this is what I'd need you to do. I'd focus on that "on/ off", intermittant connection thing you described. Everytime, my last partner would do this, it was like a dagger to the heart...repeateded daggers, over and over, every time she switched "off".
I cannot express to you, how corosive that is over time. ( the daggers ) Perhaps, if she felt like the connection would stay, she might trust that your relationship would last and she wouldn't be so focused on a future without you ( and the money ).
You said something that caught my eye that I can make a suggestion as one example:
"We used to go out for dinner, and after the meal was done and she just wanted to continue to connect and finish her wine, I would want to leave. [Sitting still at a table was agony.] I felt terrible about this. But I just couldn't hide it."
Here's where you can trust ( me being hyperactive especially in my past ). I've been this way most of my life. I KNOW the agony of trying to sit still. Getting alnost panic attacks, clostrophobic feeking, the agony you described. For me, it started in Church before grade school. Nothing bwtween heaven and earth was WORSE, than going to Church and "sitting still". It was like torture and I hated every second of it...I could not wait until it was over so the torture would stop. To this day, that experience still stays with me. I avoud church like the plaque to this day, it conjures such strong adverse feelings. You could easiky say, I hate "that feeling" with a passion, so I simply avoid church in it's entirety.
But I also expienced this with my ex wife when we'd go to dinner with her father. Her father enjoyed going to dinner and talking for hours ( seemingly about nothing )...and he liked to do most of the talking. After an hour, I was about to lose my mind. I stsrted getting that panic attack feeking again ( like church ) and I'd excuse myself, pretending to go to the bathroom. But instead of the bathroom, I'd walk outside and walk around the block ( or parking lot ) for 10 minutes. Everyone would say "what happened to you??" and I'd lie and say " there was a line".
I finally admitted that I had nothing against her father, but I felt trapped by his endless stories about people I didn't know. Further, I told her, I have about one hour at dinner before I stsrted feeling anxious like I had to get up and leave.
What I found was, moving from the bar, to the table, having dinner, then going sonewhere else for desert of that glass of wine, served to solve this problem. By breaking it up into 3 different places: the bar ( then move ), the dining area ( then move ) and finally, a 3rd stop at a place for desert or...that last glass of wine, made it so I could enjoy the entire evening without the agony, and without the disconnect.
And when it came to those marathon dinners with her father ( hours !!! )..I told ger the truth, and said " when I get up and leave to supposedly go to the bathroom, Im realky going outside so I can bresthe again. We jept that between us, so I could subtly get up abd exscuse myself, to go walk around tge block. I found, a five minute walk outside, served to "reset"...so I could continue for round twi or three...of hearing her father talk about nothing for hours.
My point being. I found a solution to "my personal problem". No one else at the table had a problem....it was only me. I found something that worked, and I presebted it to my wife as a work around including the "multiple venue" fix.
I'd suggest you try to find the same. Something that works, so the connection is not "switched off" because of this thing you abd I both experience. I just did something different, instead of the same thing over a over and hiding the fact that I was about to jump out of my skin, if I didbt get some relief from the "agony".
You're focusing on your agony...and neglecting to consider the "daggers" to her heart every time you disconnect. If it means that much to you, then finding a work around, seems like the prudent thing to do ?
Instead of doing the same thing over and over. IMHO
Thanks for the feedback.
Thanks for the feedback. Yes, I am under no delusion that this isn't a ME problem. And that is honestly what we do now. We'll go somewhere else for a nightcap. It also helps if we are having 2 drinks at dinner for me to just wait to order my 2nd. I don't consider this a significant problem anymore. But nice to know others have the same hangup.
And yes, she has had to deal with the on/off for 20 years. More if you count our fairly long courtship. I have been recently reading "Attached" as I am wondering if I have an avoidant attachment style which would explain A LOT. Comments have been made by my sister related to our mother and how she showed affection that I honestly never considered. My wife for YEARS wanted me to dig into my mother with my therapist and I just sort of avoided it beyond talking about boundaries and such. But apparently being avoidant attachment is from how your caregiver was with you, and you don't remember really what wasn't there. If I wasn't given emotional connection from my parents how would I ever know it wasn't something I was supposed to have?
I has to be just terrible to be with someone who cant think straight when they are disconnected from you but then breaks the connection when you start to open up again. So F-ed up. I'm fairly certain that deep down she thinks I don't love her. And why would she? The part that really worries me is that my brain is wired like that, and I'll never be able to stop doing it. I am though hopeful about some of the newer therapies.
There is hope
"The part that really worries me is that my brain is wired like that, and I'll never be able to stop doing it. I am though hopeful about some of the newer therapies."
Speaking only from my own experience. Therapy is what helped me shift my insecure attachememt to what's been been termed as "earned secure". You can change it yes, but it takes s lot of dedicated effort. It takes time and patience but it can be done. It's an on gojng process really, the more effort you put into it, the more it can change.
In fact, when I question my psychologist ( in my case ) he told me once, he wasn't focused on my ADHD ( him being mildly ADHD himself ), he was focused on this aspect of my treatment more than anything else. I'm not going to say it was easy, but it definitely changed things from where they were. It can be done, if you put in the work. Get 'er done.
so sad
The saddest thing about all this is for me is the paragraph where you say you feel excited and motivated and are going to try new treatments, therapies, etc.
I wonder if it's an inherent (though not necessarily universal) part of some ADHD psychologies. It's certainly what happened with my ex. That things have to get to breaking point, before something clicks, and effort can be made.
It's tragic from your point of view, and heartbreaking for the spouse. To the spouse it feels like a long-term lack of care, lack of interest, and then, bam! self-interest kicks in.
I know that's not how you feel or intend, but I do want to suggest that might well be how your partner sees it. It felt devastatingly hurtful to me, when my ex started trying to improve things, finally, after decades of asking, but only when I was at rock bottom, had suicidal thoughts, and was asking for a divorce. Your partner will probably feel raw about this too, and that will need navigating.
I would talk with an attorney
I would talk with an attorney if I were you. Also, it sounds like you two have been through a lot. There are scars. "I would do anything . . . ." What are you doing? You don't say, "I made an appointment to see a therapist" or "I'm seeing my doctor next week."
My suggestion is for you to see an attorney before signing anything but also recognize that DOING trumps talking. Action is what changes things, not talk, not regret, not sorrys.
Best of luck.
Honesty and hyper focus could make a difference
I am so sorry to hear your story. I can tell that you really do love your partner.
It would be nice if there were a reminder system that could simply remind us to show our partners that love. And I’m actually not kidding! An acquaintance of mine, an AuDHD financial coach who is in a dual-ADHD relationship, once told me that her partner programmed a location-based reminder that goes off when he reaches their front yard. It reminds him to ask her how her day was. Every single day. Sometimes something that seems like it “should” come naturally actually needs a system behind it.
My husband and I did a lot of work to save ourselves from divorce, both together and separately, and we are quite happy together now.
Others here have already given you a lot of good advice, so I won’t repeat all of it. But I can tell you what started to change things for us.
We had a very honest conversation about what I needed in order to stay married. Instead of trying to fix everything at once, we picked one thing at a time that he—or both of us—would work on. My husband actually used his ability to hyperfocus to push through and make progress on that first thing.
Seeing him really work at it gave me something I desperately needed at that point: hope. It helped me see that he loved me and was willing to fight for our marriage.
Then we took the next step. We learned skills that helped us communicate better. We started working more as a team and troubleshooting problems together instead of constantly being on opposite sides of them.
That’s how we slowly went from being on the verge of divorce to being happy together today.
Does my husband still forget things? Absolutely. Probably 10% of the time! The difference is that now we have the skills to talk through problems and look for solutions together when something isn't working.
If you still love each other and there is still a willingness on both sides to try, I wouldn't give up hope just because you're close to separation. A relationship can change tremendously when you stop trying to fix everything at once and start finding the next thing you can work on.
We came very close to divorce, and we found our way back. I’m living proof that it can happen. So I hope that gives you hope too.
Good luck
N4ally2