Submitted by PoisonIvy on 03/21/2017.
Those are his words, but I believe they're accurate. He told me this weekend that he knows this is true because he prefers sitting with his mom, who has late-stage Alzheimer's disease and can't process communication, than being with his dad (and, presumably, with me). In a way, this doesn't matter anymore (we're now divorced), but it still hurts. I wonder if he ever told any of the several therapists he visited over the years that part of the problem was his inability to form connections and it wasn't only my fault that our relationship was rocky and his life wasn't going well.
Connections
Submitted by jennalemone on
Now that I see this in words, I have to say that this might be the case with my H also. I can't know what the depth of his connections are because he does not share with me his real thoughts or feelings (not a trusting connection here either).
But I might ask those with ADD. Do you feel that you have a difficult time making personal connections? J, it seems to me that you have been putting out a great effort to connect with us and with your wife, so maybe this is not something all ADDers have, but PoisonIvy, this seems to be the case here too. I will be considering this about H today. I will be considering his connections with our children, his family and his friends. He seems to talk on the phone for a long time with (guys?) I don't know. It seems to be people he can cuss and talk shop with. He has long conversations with neighbors. But he seems to be silent and short with family who might need or want something from him or who know his failings and he doesn't want to be vulnerable.
Anyway, H has made it very clear that he thinks of himself and is proud of himself for being independent and do his own thing.
ADHD, here
Submitted by Terra on
I think we each develop coping strategies along the way - I guess.
When my plans involve other people, I check with them that we're agreed, and I do my own planning, for my side of things. For example, I know already that my mood/feelings in the preparation time will probably have no bearing on the moments we'll be together. While doing whatever's needed to make our activity happen, I may feel a raft of emotions, strongly. So? Emotions are clues - sometimes about the relationships, sometimes about me. I remind myself of what the intended goal is. (I've met people who believe that when we're on the right track, everything flows, in a logical procession. Maybe some, but not me. And so what?)
On the other hand, for things I'll be doing on my own, simply getting things done, I tend to not say my plans, because chances are good that I'll rearrange them. Long conversations about why things got done in a different order, and different way, are tedious. Especially when all that matters is things got done.
Dunno if that's helpful. My relationships with others matter to me. I well understand tolerating discomfort just because real life requires us to consider others as well as ourselves - and vice versa. Doing my best, failing sometimes - apologizing, for some of those - imperfect, like everybody is.
ADHD or not, we're all our individual selves. Some people are more willing to put themselves out for others. I've met non-ADHD people who don't, and ADHD people who do. Depends more on values, I suspect.
PS I really don't know. Does my brother (also ADHD) truly not care enough, that when he was in my city, he only emailed me after getting here? When I saw the email, days later, I wrote how disappointed I was to have missed him... No reply.
Maybe his wife usually arranges family things, when it's her family, but I don't know. Nor does our other brother, ADHD as well.
Thank you Terra,,,,
Submitted by c ur self on
I've read so many post that I have been able to I.D. with over the years....But, this beautifully and honestly written little post says so much to me about what I've experienced but never understood, not until a lot of damage had been done...I think you put into words what my W has been unable to do...(Probably many reason's for it)...
On the broad spectrum of personality and operating in life, (the working of the mind) we are so opposite... But, if we had had the ability for calmness and honesty in communication, we would have been able to gain a better understanding early on....
When a couple is always defending their own way of thinking and doing things, (both of us) instead of helping their spouse to understand how they think (esp. w/ all the difference's we have) then you never really can find a peaceful place, except for short spurts...Then all H breaks loose...I hated it!
I want go on but I will just say much of what you wrote describes my W to a tee...The caring about people...the not saying anything (or saying she did, when she didn't) about her plans until the last minute...Because she calls herself spontaneous...LOL...I'm a planner, so she is constantly hitting me at the last minute...And I'm like Really!..lol....We have to have boundaries around time management and planning to protect us both...
She would feel just like you about the brother thing..Just like you!... and she wouldn't have seen the email either...She keeps about 30,000 and may check it once every week or two...Her voice mail stays full much of the time....If I want her I text or call, she will check her text pretty regular...Just who she is...
I'm just the opposite, anyway just wanted to say thank you, this was so helpful to read from someone...
C
Jenna You Rang? LOL
Submitted by kellyj on
I've actually been connecting to people in my past via face book for the first time. After years, in some cases, I've been talking to people I knew in school going all the way back to 1rst grade in some cases and it's been an interesting experience with some even more interesting results? In this case, I knew these people or have been friends with them before, but now re-connecting, I've found a disparagey among them (or division ) between them that is really noticeable and quite interesting? Some, I didn't know well before, seem ,more in line with what I'm thinking now, and some who I did know fairly well, seem more difficult to connect with which is actually part of my thinking here? And then there is the case, of meeting new people from around the world who share the same thinking as I do from a completely different culture. One guy, I really connected with and we got into some pretty deep conversations where we were totally on the same page. I found out, only after communicating with him for a while, that he lives in South Africa and is Black, which I really don';t care either way, but it was interesting that we connected better, than some people I new from my own neighborhood growing up? I think more than anything, connecting has to do with understanding one another and being on the same page? There are a lot of people ( as I found ) every where, where I simply am not going to agree with their beliefs or what they believe is true and there is no way you are going to get them to believe differently if someone is closed off to entertaining a different idea of the way they think things should be? The you go again....."should be"......'suppose to".......could have , would have, should have.
But then again, I am approaching everyone know with a different perspective of my own? I know I'm different, I know I have a different kind of brain, and I know I see things differently than the average person? I've gone in with that attitude, that I'm the one who's different but, being different in that respect, is perfectly fine with me? I'm Okay with that, which also makes me open to hear anyone or entertain what people say, knowing that what ever it is I think, I assume its going to be different anyway? Which means, what I expect, is different too with an open mind and with assuming anything which is really what I got from spending so much time here and hearing what people are saying?
Mostly what I'm hearing here, is pretty consistently true. Most people who come here, are in the same place at the same time so to speak so it's the same things coming together in this one group as a whole? That might be really validating on one hand, to know that your not alone with what you all are going through, but, I think there can be a false sense that everyone is the same as everyone here as well? If this was on face book, it would be a select group that share the same experiences , struggles and problems together which makes this a great place to find things out and share those experiences? But as I'm saying this, you will find something for everyone there on face book if you look hard enough? Even within the group, that I knew from school, there are those I simply can't relate to anymore...and then there are those where I can?
What you said here is really hitting the mark I think: " He seems to talk on the phone for a long time with (guys?) I don't know. It seems to be people he can cuss and talk shop with. He has long conversations with neighbors. But he seems to be silent and short with family who might need or want something from him or who know his failings and he doesn't want to be vulnerable. "
Jenna, I think, you are right, but it doesn't stop there. Relating and connecting go hand in hand? If you can't relate, share interests, and talk about these things with someone who wants to listen and exchange ideas...then there is no connection there just to start? Now add emotions and deeper topics into this mix especially involving your feelings about anything controversial or emotionally charged? What I found was quite by accident...that I walked into a Shit Storm of political upheaval when I walked into the door on face book? Man, if you want to see the "stuff", come out of the wood work, that's the perfect way to do it? In my usual 'Independent" way, I try not to take sides on either side of these debates since I am not either a republican, or a democrat and I don't really identify solely with one group or another? The real problems with come with symbolic ideology and beliefs pertaining to religion especially? If you want to see people dig their heels in, and put their heads in the sand and stop listening, get that conversation going and it will go no where fast if you don't agree with someone exactly, who has strong opinions and strong feelings about a topic like that, with no wiggle room what so ever? All of that dogma, stereotypes and beliefs....put a big wall up between people which is the same kind of wall that I run into with my wife when she does the same thing? As soon as your mind shuts off, to hearing anything new or entertaining a different perspective or a different way of seeing the same thing as someone else? There's no where to go, and no room for what you might think or feel, or a different position ( possibly) entirely than they have without forming some kind of opinion , and or jumping to conclusions and then making it so? If you can't adapt, adjust, become flexible and mailable yourself....or if the other person cannot do this with you? The you can't relate on the same level, can't be on the same page together and cannot connect with them, it's as simple as that? And it kind of works both ways?
In fact, I had one guy, call me a piece of shit ( out and out ) for something he misinterpreted, but at the same time was trying to stir the pot a little, to see what I would do? You might think, that if someone calls you a piece of shit, that you don't even know.....most likely, you would probably write that person off and never talk to them again? As it turns out, I now talk to this guy more, agree with him more, and we see eye to eye on more things than anyone else? Once we got past that initial bump in misunderstanding...we understand each other clearly and we are both on the same page? It;a because we "feel the same" about the same things, and can relate to one another, without having to talk it through...or be afraid of saying the wrong thing or upsetting the other person. I don;t agree with this guy 100% on everything, but the point here is saying, we connected and that's just it?
I think if I've learned anything from that experience? Not being afraid to expose yourself, not being afraid of someone calling you out or even telling you, your a piece of shit because they misinterpreted something you said and assumed the wrong thing, has everything to do with being open and willing to keep trying to find some common ground...or otherwise, you just go off and feel hurt or upset or you just don;t give a damn? What I found is, being persistent, consistent and being able to take some hits and not let that effect you, was really the secret to connecting with people but saying, I only connect with some people there...and definitely not others? There are people there, who are so determined and rigid and unbending from what they believe, there;s just no way to get through that wall, and through all that is on the surface to get to what underneath that, and actual connect with them? At all?
Any way, I came back here just to check in and see how you all are doing, and I saw you mention me which caught my eye so I thought I would give you an update? What I have found more than anything else, was that learning to do this with a bunch of strangers from all over the world....is easier at times than doing the same thing with my wife at times, but everything I just said while it's still fresh from that experience, is exactly what I found to make the difference either positively or negatively depending on?
That one experience I mentioned with this one gentleman from South Africa...was really interesting to experience...without knowing a thing about him, what he looked like or even what country he was from? And yet....here we are...1/2 way around the world in completely different worlds apart...and yet, we still connected and still see things in almost exactly the same way? Different country, different color of skin and completely different in almost every way, except for the ones that count? We just found each other, by exposing ourselves and becoming vulnerable and listening even if we don;t fully agree on everything which at that point, is not a problem what so ever. Being open or closed has everything to do with it I think? For what it's worth?
J
J, Connecting as much as I can
Submitted by jennalemone on
Thanks for responding. I seem to NEED personal connection and it is frustrating when the person you want to connect with the most doesn't seem to need to connect AT ALL. I have a sister who I ask questions of about these things because she seems to be similar to H in many ways of relating to people. She told me that when her H was alive, it would not have bothered her in the least if they had not spoken for a week (or ever) as long as they got together for her physical needs and then she was done for the week again. This is preposterous to me!!!! I am so the opposite. There is no physical desire if there is no personal connection for me. Boy, people are sure all different. I guess that is what you are saying, J, that you never know where or how you might find connections. Maybe H is finding connections somewhere, just not here and in a way he is more able to relate. I don't know. There just seems to be no EFFORT to connect at home. So I sit here on an anonymous site trying for some small connections.
One of the things you mentioned is that if you stayed with it with someone who challenges you, you can find ways and reasons to converse and enjoy it. Yes, I have found that to be true. Often I become friends with someone who, at first glance/meeting I would never have chosen or thought we could have any common ground. The people who I gravitate to are the showey, animated, funny, confident people who are energized by others and by close encounters. I have learned over the years that the unassuming quieter person is better suited to me and if I just keep in there without getting discouraged, those quiet people become people I like... it just takes a little more time and effort at the beginning.
My H too.
Submitted by adhd32 on
I have yet to figure this trait out.
H had a life-long friend who was dying and H just refused to call him or visit him. He didn't offer any help to the family and just felt sorry for himself. I felt like a fool going to the guys wake. He was my friend too but the connection was through my socially inept spouse who cannot seem to deal with any uncomfortable feelings.
Two weekends ago he was annoyed with me because he wants to spend a social weekend with another life-long friend of his and his wife. I even went so far as getting my calendar out and told him when I was free and to let me know when we will visit....still waiting, he hasn't called his friend. I love this couple but I do not have a close connection with the wife. I told him that he is your friend and to make the arrangements. I stay in touch with my friends and we do things with and without our spouses, I told him I cannot run his social calendar too. If friends mean something to you then YOU have to make an effort and sometimes that means contacting them several times to get things moving along. H seems to be incapable of planning ahead for anything and claims he likes to be spontaneous. He cannot see that this other couple, who each have their own businesses, do not have the luxury of last minute planning. He was very critical of planning when our children were young and he could not understand why things were planned to the day. How can you travel with an infant not knowing where you will be sleeping?
Another long time friend is ill and H likes to report his condition to me via third hand information. God forbid he should pick up the phone and say hi.
H's brother had a minor surgery and I asked how he was doing. His reply: "I dunno". I pulled out my phone without saying anything and texted his wife and got an update. He was mad when I relayed the update to him. Why?
I guess if there is nothing in it for him he isn't interested. Or maybe he is afraid something will be required of him and he will have to come out of his comfort zone and actually be a human being and compromise (something he doesn't do well). I would love to know why he acts like a jerk when confronted with uncomfortable situations.
Someone with ADD please jump in, I am extremely curious about this.
My Take
Submitted by love that girl on
If I may offer my two cents....Non-ADHD male experienced with ex SO female (C). Poison Ivy I understand. With my love she CAN'T form personal connections. I saw it many times, in her case she couldn't because she might be found out. That's what happened to me when I discovered the fact of the ADHD and offered to work with her. C would be fine with anyone as long as the "A" word was not mentioned or "when will you finally get your act together" question came up. Big time denial present. I went to a psychiatrist appointment with C and after 30 minutes of discussion about flowers, vacations etc. I asked the question "can we talk about the ADHD" his response was "you're right, he IS a control freak". Frankly I don't think the guy had a clue about ADHD and was happy to take the $75 each week. C was perfectly willing to have conversations with people who would just listen for the most part, in particular when C would talk about her children (1 teen and 2 twenty somethings - all with ADHD) and how bad they were. Neighbors and passers by were ok as well, essentially relationships not requiring much involvement.
Jennalemone,being silent and short with anyone who might require something appearing to be a real two way relationship my C was very short and silent for the most part. Then suddenly the uncontrolled anger would also kick in. (All in C's family including siblings clearly have anger issues. DESR a big component).
To adhd32 I offer this. Though I was 15 years removed, C's in laws indicated that when her husband died C seemed disconnected. In response C's comments have been that the in laws were nowhere to be found helping with the children before and after the death. I hate to say it but the in laws family is close knit and therefore I find the idea they were not available hard to believe. C has had a history of playing the poor widow since. C also is a born again Christian yet after 6 months with her at her church I began to ask where is the connection with your fellow Church members? (By the way, I wound up being the bad guy at Church as well....long story involving angry outbursts with family members who don't believe in God). What happened with your brother in law; C's response to me in similar cases was "are you trying to make me look bad? The statement "maybe he is afraid something will be required of him and he will have to come out of his comfort zone and actually be a human being and compromise" is all too true. Tonight I received a call from a mother of a friend of the youngest,16. The boy was visiting her son and she wanted to monitor what they were watching on a popular online movie viewing site. In checking she saw a fairly pornographic movie in the "continue watching" list. After the boys vehemently denied watching she dug deeper and it was discovered the movie was currently being viewed on C's (moms) computer. I can only imagine the embarrassment the boy felt. I recommended the boys and the mother keep it between them as the repercussions could be severe and violent.
I have a hundred more stories. I was deeply wounded by all this, but I will say I would jump right back in with someone who could take a real evaluation of the circumstances and monitor them....call me a fool.
I too would like to see some responses from folks with ADHD. Perhaps one of the moderators could kick in.
Lack of connections: ADHD husband same
Submitted by dedelight4 on
This is a subject that I've been thinking about a lot lately also. My ADHD husband ALSO can not make connections with people, but especially not with me, or our daughters. He connects in very shallow, surface type ways. He has limited conversations, (politics especially, but NO personal talk) and gets defensive at the slightest HINT of anything that he perceives as "criticism".(even if it isn't) But, his "connections" with people are more like him talking to others about himself, and how much of a genius he is. (I'm so tired of him talking about his IQ, it makes me crazy to hear it all over again) who DOES this?
The ONLY person he has a true love connection with is our six year old granddaughter. That, seems beyond strange to me. He loves her to pieces, and shows her a lot of attention and affection, etc, but she's been the ONLY one he's done this with. Why?...............because he CHOSE to do that, and he ALLOWED himself to feel the feelings of love and act ON those feelings to SHOW her he loves her...................IT IS POSSIBLE..... SO HE CAN DO IT.....where I have always doubted is this was possible. But, then again, WHY? and why HER? I thought this out also. It's because she doesn't NEED him for anything, and she doesn't ask or need him to DO anything for her. She has her Mommy, Daddy, Grandma, Aunt and Uncle, and lots of relatives and friends, who show her TONS of love, acceptance and nurture, and she is very self confident and loving. But, it is the ones who NEED love and attention and acceptance from him that he won't GIVE this to. But, this has hurt HIM in the long run also. He has robbed himself, me, our daughters and extended family from his love, attention, touch, and CONNECTION because he chooses NOT to do this. (for whatever reasons, physical, mental, spiritual or all 3)
So, to live with him means, don't NEED anything from him, don't ASK anything from him, and don't bother him with "sharing yourself with me". This is where the living separate lives, but living in the same house came from. He did admit to me this past weekend that he realized that the way he's been acting towards US, is because he couldn't deal with RESPONSIBILITY. He kept wanting to "go back to his college years", and re-live the fun and carefree life he HAD back then, because he only had to worry about HIMSELF. But, this past year (being separate) he realized this was just a fantasy, and that even when he was in college, he WASN'T HAPPY, he was just doing what he wanted to do, with no real consequences from his actions.
But, there WAS fallout from his unchecked ADHD behavior, because girlfriends left him, friends left him, and he didn't even SEE it, because of course, "it was always THEIR fault". (the blame thing mixed with denial) Everything was someone ELSE'S fault, which he still believed until just recently. Him living BY himself, with NO ONE around, and no one to make all the messes, and no one to break anything, but him, and no one else to eat up ALL the food, no one to run up the light bill, no one to leave the television on, or use the water, or dent the car, ETC, ETC, ETC. It's been ALL HIM, and he's seen he doesn't even like LIVING WITH HIMSELF, because he creates a ton of chaos around himself. He finally admitted that, this weekend also.
I still am taking everything he says with a grain of salt, because I KNOW HIM. He could change his mind again tomorrow, or an hour from now, because that's been the profile for ALL THIS TIME. He's 61 now, and I don't see him changing any time soon, especially without some intense ADHD behavior help.
I will be going back to the house for a while to get all our paperwork, legal papers and such together. Everything is a TOTAL MESS, and I mean everything. I was astounded at how many more things were broken and just wrecked, along with the messiness which is EVERYWHERE and in EVERY ROOM. This is a fairly large house, 3 bedroom with a huge bonus room, and 2 car garage. Every room is filled with stuff, junk and mess is EVERYWHERE, and it's all HIS STUFF.
I can't continue on with MY life, until I know where the two of us stand financially, along with all the insurances, bills, etc. The lights get turned out, and then he pays late, (because he forgot), he 'forgets" to pay the phone bill, water bill, mortgage, everything, but has always INSISTED on doing the money himself. I was wrong for letting him do this, but now this changes. After that, we will see where things stand. But, I HAVE to know where our lives are financially, because it doesn't look good right now. I will call in help, if it's too bad, and have someone unbiased, who knows finances, to help solve some of this.
Anyway, just thought i"d update you guys a little, and talk on this subject. Hope the rest of you are doing well.
dedelight Wow!
Submitted by love that girl on
hI dedelight! Wow what profound feelings. You are an incredible person indeed. As for the unwinding of things,,,you have made incredible progress already, Perhaps better to just go your way, I don't really know. It is words from people like you that make me prepared to just turn away, people like us are ever hopeful somehow......love perhaps. One last word....seem like you are ready to continue on with YOUR life....a goal of mine too. Thank you and be blessed sweet girl. Peace
Common ground is probably
Submitted by PoisonIvy on
Common ground is probably necessary but not sufficient to form personal connections, at least in the way my ex was using the term "personal connections." Common ground could be shared interests, shared hobbies, similar beliefs, similar likes and dislikes, similar upbringing, same religion, etc. Personal connections have to do with emotions: letting oneself be vulnerable and being open to other people's vulnerabilities; being willing to do things that might result in hurt (i.e., loving someone even though the pain will be great when that person leaves or dies). Ex and I had much common ground, but I can form personal connections and he can't or won't.