Hey everyone,
I am so glad I found this forum. I literally googled how do I handle my ADHD husband not being able to get to work on time? This forum was in the search results. I just spent a little while reading some of the posts. Oh man is it a relief to know that there are others. I thought I was the only person on this earth crazy enough to put up with some of the things that go on.
One of the current problems is that he is late to work all the time. We can’t seem to beat it no matter what we try. His bosses constantly council him and ask what is going on ect. For a few days to a week that will work. I will jump on him and nag him like a mom getting their kid up for school but then the moment I lay off he falls back into the same pattern. He has time blindness which we work on constantly and is not so much of a big deal in our home life because I can remind him but there is only so much I can do when it comes to his job. In the past it has been so bad that his work has actually asked him if he has a drug or alcohol problem. He doesn’t, neither of us have ever drank or used drugs.
What is happening right now:
He has to get a physical for work by August 31st so that his insurance doesn’t go up by $100 next year. He has known about this since March. He had an appointment for two weeks ago for blood work which he got done and then the following Friday was supposed to be his physical. That morning I woke him up with an hour and a half to get ready to leave. He got up and got dressed (slowly) and sat around until he only had 15 minutes to get all the way across town. He of course didn’t call and tell them he was running late. By the time he got there they canceled his appointment and told him there were no more openings until September 9th. So instead of waiting to be worked in he left.
I was/am having my own problems that I struggle with (insomnia, anxiety, and depression) and that day was a particularly bad day. When he came home and told me about it we had a big fight. Then I finally went to sleep. He did too only he was needing to wake up in time to donate plasma so that we could buy our dogs some food. Since I didn’t set a clock he didn’t even think about it so he woke up right when the place was closing. I ended up cooking for the dogs that night so they could eat.
The next day Saturday he donated plasma and got $25 which he used $14 of to buy pizza on the way home. The dogs got cheap dog food with extras from the fridge added in. Saturday night we also went to work on our place that we are building(a whole other story). The insulation that we have been working on since the beginning of the year finally got finished. In the process he hurt his back.
So this past Monday when his upper back was still causing him pain he decided to stay off work and get an appointment with the doctor that we are switching over to soon. He wanted to be seen for his back and see if they could get his physical done before the end of the month. So he took off work fully knowing that he didn’t have the hours to cover a full day. The doctor gave him a muscle relaxer which of course made him sleepy.
Today Tuesday he didn’t wake up until close to when he should have been leaving the house for work. Still he leisurely got showered and dressed for work. He texted me earlier that his boss talked to him about it all and suggested that he should look into counseling through their system at work and maybe consider stress leave if things are that hard for him. I text him back and said no we just need to change your habits to get you to work on time. It is bad work ethic to take off because you are having time and attendance problems. I guess that made him mad because all I got for a reply was an O.K. and then he didn’t call me on his lunch hour which he normally does. So I decided to call him. He was annoyed and started griping and then accusing me of being mad at him for thinking about taking stress leave. I explained that I am not mad. I just think taking off isn’t the answer but I think we just need to do things differently and get more organized.
I have suggested in the past for him to use his phone to set reminders and alarms. He has tried that but he doesn’t seem to have a good time concept to set them by. He has a leave now alarm with he will completely ignore. I mean what do you do with that? Ideally when a leave now alarm goes off you should grab all your stuff and walk out the friggen door not turn it off and take another bite.
I know that he knows he isn’t doing things the right way because he is always verbalizing how he is screwing everything up. He has and understands the tools that he needs to use to fix the problem but he just doesn’t change the behavior himself. I can’t do it for him because it doesn’t stick. The minute I loosen the reigns he just goes off everywhere. I am very scared that he will lose his job and things will get worse again. He has had this job for 8+ years and is finally getting reports of doing solid work from his bosses. Quite literally his only problem in that area is his time and attendance.
So for now I have set five different cell phone alarms for in the morning all five minutes apart. That way if they are snoozed they will stack up and annoy him out of bed. I am going to try and have his lunch ready to go the night before as well as some breakfast with protein or some sort. Also I am going to ask him to shower and lay out his clothes before he gets into bed at night instead of in the morning. It sounds good, but who knows how it will actually happen. He usually doesn’t hear me because he is angry or having a pity party.
Doctors appointment this coming Friday with blood work results I am praying that they don’t tell him he is diabetic. I really don’t want that for him health wise and I selfishly don’t want the added stress of dealing with the diet changes. That sounds horrible but there is already so much to deal with.
I'm glad you found the forum
Submitted by PoisonIvy on
I'm glad you found the forum but sorry you're in a situation to need to be here.
My husband had problems getting out of the house in the morning. (He chose to become his parents' caregiver four years ago and lives with them, so now he doesn't have to "be" places very much.) One thing that really struck me was the length of his hygiene routine. Between the shower and the drying off and putting on of lotion (he has very dry skin), he'd be in the bathroom at least half an hour and often 45 minutes. He never seemed able to do it any less slowly.
Oh yes I know what you are
Submitted by sev15 on
Oh yes I know what you are talking about there. My hubby will take a half hour to sit on the toilet on his phone before the lengthy showering even begins. I know he is actually a member of several groups for ADHD, Facebook and other interests so it isn't a big deal if he wants to spend some time doing those things. However it either needs to be planned so he has extra time or just do it in free time not before work. When I address it as an issue he just says oh well im not awake yet. I don't ever wake up fully until my pill kicks in.
sigh.
I don't know what the answer is....
Submitted by overwhelmedwife on
My Father-in-law's answer to not having to "be at work" at any particular time was to start his own business. He first worked for a company, but realizing that he couldn't meet the "demands" to be there at a certain time, he started his own business, with an office phone that also rings at home (in case a call comes in before he gets to his office).
That was his solution and it worked for him. He never made a lot of money, but he at least earned enough to support his family and they never feared that he'd lose his job.
Not everyone can do this, but I'm just saying that this is what some do.
Their older son did a similar thing. He also can rarely get anywhere on time, except for court, he's a lawyer. He knows that he would get into huge trouble being late for court so he does get there on time. But EVERYTHING else he is very late. He also works for himself. He could never work for a law firm because there would be meetings and such that he would never be on time for.
Also, by working for himself, he can work as little or as much as he wants.
Your H sounds a bit like these relatives. Stubborn with ADHD. They almost need someone with a hot stick poking them along.
How was your H growing up? Was he always late to school? Was he allowed to take forever getting ready in the morning?
I would explain to him that he really only has two choices every morning:
1) Get up extra early, so that he can spend an hour getting ready
2) Sleep in a bit and take a quick shower and dress quickly....and no looking at his phone or TV or any distractions. I'd be tempted to take his phone when he gets up late and not let him have it until he's in his car leaving for work.
It seems that he thinks he can sleep in AND spend an hour getting ready.
Has he been in therapy? He does need it. '
Was he able to get his physical?
The story that he missed his physical and didn't stick around to see if he could be worked in is classic. People with some types of ADHD are not resourceful at all. Any little hurdle and they fold like a cheap tent. They can't find alternate solutions.
That would be truly great if
Submitted by sev15 on
That would be truly great if he was able to start a business of some sort and not have to answer to anyone. Unfortunately he is a mechanic and we really just don't have the means to start something up. I have several business ideas but we are still working on fixing credit issues from the last 13 years. Maybe someday though.
As far as hubby goes yes he is VERY stubborn to a point of exhaustion. Only he will appear to be the most agreeable teddy bear type guy in the world. His famous phrase is "I learn things the hard way, I always have"
His childhood is something I am still piecing together. He comes from divorced parents who had an ugly split when he was in his early teens. His mom kind of flaked out on them and his dad just worked a lot so the majority of his life skills were learned before the age of 14. The rest I have fought my way through to show him over time. Anyway I have asked him before about his time management with school and apparently he was always early to school. I think that has a lot to do with the fact that he was on a routine. Honestly though he is always pretty vague about his childhood and only remembers tid bits here and there so honestly who knows.
He has been in therapy a little tiny bit. In college I was a psychology major and from the moment I met him he would insult therapists. I asked him repeatedly for years to look into it. Finally when he got into major trouble at work around 2009 they put him through their employee program that pays for counseling. We were very rocky at the time and when he came home telling me all the wonderful things the therapist suggested to him I was an absolute beast to him because it was mostly what I had been saying to him for years.Then of course he told her all about that and she wanted me to come see her too. Again in my immaturity I completely rejected it so he just stopped. Then last year he was again referred to a counselor by his work because of his time and attendance issues. I encouraged him this time and he went a few times and talked about his stress and his mom. Then he started having issues getting to the councilors office on time so once again he quit. Now when it is brought up he says he doesn't have time and he doesn't see what a therapist could offer him that he doesn't already know.
His physical is this coming Friday along with blood work results and a follow up on his back. Hopefully it will all work out. The doctor also told him that they will be changing his blood pressure meds. So hopefully some of the anger and frustration will settle down.
:) Thanks for replying you guys. Im sorry for rambling but its been a long time since I have been able to get these thoughts outside of my own head.
Time Blindness/Executive Function/Responsibility
Submitted by I'm So Exhausted on
Hello sev15,
I hope you find some insight and new ideas here on this forum.
Reading your post has brought to my mind some history I saw - (This is Liz's judgment and what she saw) - in my spouse.
Our son is 26, and his ADHD was diagnosed in 4th grade. My spouse was not diagnosed until 4-5 years ago. Thus, our son knew who was was, and learned to live with how his brain worked. On the other hand, my spouse will now admit he knew something was just not right, and he could never understand why he didn't seem to be like everyone else. And, there too was the lifetime of authority figures letting him know he was not living up to expectations. . . . he just had his 58th birthday.
When I met him, way back in 1982, he worked for a man who built houses. His boss referred to him as Lard Ass - because he couldn't drag his fat butt to work on time - (THAT bothered me , my spouse thought it was an endearment, ugh!) - and he indeed was late a lot. My spouse was also in the process of starting his own business - as he states - because he wanted to be in charge of himself, and no one was going to tell him what time to arrive or what to do. He was going to be in charge of himself.
Flash forward to 2015, and my spouse has no particular time schedule. He does indeed own and run his own construction business. Enter here the stereotypical contractor - usually not on time, some days decides not to show up, stays at jobs till - (in my opinion) - ungodly hours, has no routine. Now, indeed, some of that has to do with how much work is available. SOME. Not all. He will to this day schedule jobs for 8 am. Our son is ready to go. His helper is here ready to go. And my spouse just gets out of bed at 8 am. Then has to eat. Then he makes a few phone call. Then he will call the job and say something along the line of how he got tied up and will be there in 1-2-3 hours.
This works in my spouse's favor as he is self employed. And, while he does have some regulars, most customers are new and have no idea of his work pattern. Believe me, this man does impeccable work! Perfect. Tidy. Cleans up after a job. Has come up with many, many, creative solutions to problems. He gets 100 Gold Stars in that arena.
As a spouse, living with this timing chaos, it indeed wears on me. There are the days when he will jump out of bed, and comes rushing down the stairs, swearing "Oh shit!" as if he never had slept in late before. It is a reoccurring pattern. He chooses not to see it, so it is not something he addresses. I spent enough years trying to come up with solutions - there were none so far that he was willing or able to use.
When our son got old enough, he decided to become partners with his Dad. He gets frustrated and upset with the time scramble. Actually, when there was first discussion 2 years ago, about his becoming a legal partner, I encouraged him to make sure this would be something he could live with - and he chose to make it all legal. So now, I will listen to my son vent. I can commiserate with him. I can understand. But, as I had stated to him before, I cannot get in the middle of the problem. I see it. My son sees it. My spouse does not. You cannot fix/address/change a problem if there is denial about its existence.
Interestingly enough, when our son was in school and I just started to learn about and understand ADHD, I as Mom, thought our son would flourish in a relaxed learning atmosphere. In fact, what I learned, exactly the opposite was what worked wonders for him. When he was basically 'under someone's thumb' with guidelines on time structure and deadlines imposed by someone else, he was able to thrive. An example was when he went to automotive technical school after high school graduation. The school had strict guidelines - shirt must be tucked in - no hair on hanging on shirt collars - and a real biggie - school started at 8 am. The front doors got LOCKED at 8:10. If you were late, you missed school for that day. Our son had an hour drive to school. He would get up at 5. Make breakfast. Watch some TV. Get himself into the day - and leave for school. He was never late.
From the outside looking in, I witness him sort of floundering with the three days that he works in the construction business with my spouse. This is clearly HIS choice. Me as Mom is not so sure it is in his best interest. I do support his choice. Clearly, he is frustrated with time schedules, and he also loves his Dad.
Makes for a tough scenario for me, so I try, try, try to step back. I do not always succeed. I AM human, and have opinions - - - - - and lots of organizational skills, that are not wanted. So, yeah, I cannot control what is outside of my own being!
I am and was regularly disappointed by my spouse being late. For dates. For dinner. For family parties. For helping me get our children ready to get anywhere on time. He does not see any problem. THAT in itself was a problem . . . .for me.
The IDEAL of being self employed is not all it is cracked up to be. In the early years, I wanted to be the best wife, the best encourager, and keep my spouse happy. Those began the years of juggling being a Mom, and wife, and administrator of the business. I robbed Peter to pay Paul, and juggled, juggled, juggled it all. I am now very weary. An exhausted from the thankless job. And I created a monster of a financial mess. Oh, we have manageable debt - managed by my constast juggles, and adjustments, and moving this debt from here to there. . . . . to keep my husband's anger at bay - OR SO I THOUGHT. Foolish gal. .I no longer want to do it. We have a financial crisis, and I do not want it to all fall on my own head, but I know I am one toss short of having it all come tumbling down. It is a sad picture that I participated in creating, and I do not know how to extricate myself.
Liz
What a Wonderful Example Liz
Submitted by kellyj on
Hi sev15,
Liz just gave a great real accounting of this phenomenon about her husband and her son who both have ADHD. What really caught my eye was this..
His boss referred to him as Lard Ass - because he couldn't drag his fat butt to work on time - (THAT bothered me , my spouse thought it was an endearment, ugh!) - and he indeed was late a lot. My spouse was also in the process of starting his own business - as he states - because he wanted to be in charge of himself, and no one was going to tell him what time to arrive or what to do. He was going to be in charge of himself.
This is such a telling paragraph and things that her H came up with in the moment to explain what he cannot see. Is this lying? Well yes....it really is for all intensive purposes but....he just doesn't know it. Why? Because he can't see it and this is what he has come up with to explain it as his rational or in his rationalizing of his thought and feelings surrounding it.
This is red flag only as a place to start and look at.....this is part of having ADHD and is a very common thing we do. Lying in my mind (in the Christian sin sense of the word....means you know you are but are intentionally not telling the truth) Not being able to see it and thinking it is something else is just that. When I discovered these things about myself I went....oops. My bad.....I just didn't know. I can say I'm sorry that that much for sure and for all the trouble this had created for other people in my past but to say......that is when you begin to stop doing it but it does take some time to get over the old habits that you are so use to in your thinking even when this happens.
Here's what I see in her comments and the reasons why to give you a better idea for yourself so you can understand it better.
Her H's boss was trying to tell him something that he just could not see but he was doing it a way that did not bring him in front of this issue that forced him to look harder at it. The negative comment thrown in there about being a lard ass as a joke perhaps was his boss trying to be nice maybe...or just blunt and kind of rude at the same time sending him this message. Either way....her H took that and wrote it off to explain the away in the moment in a way that he was able to dismiss this without having it affect him. Again.....if you can't see it.....how can you know what someone is trying to tell you. There is an assumption or gap in this scenario on both sides with no fault with anyone in these moments.
The same thing with H's thinking about being in charge of himself. Again....there is something legitimate inside this comment that has to do with ADHD but he can't see it and makes it about something else instead.
The problem with this kind of denial especially having ADHD is that no one can see it or understands it to begin with unless you learn why this is and what is actually happening. If neither side can make out what is happening then everyone gets lost in the process.
I did this very thing at times and made some of the same conclusions that Liz's H made in some of these things. I had a chance make a career change that would require me to sit in a cubical and work off of a computer. There was a great deal of fear and concern here for me initially but I did not understand exactly why that was at the time. I chose not to do it which was a wise decision based on looking back now but that was only that I listened to this voice that was telling me no.
I know understand what that voice was telling me and even though my fears at the time and what I was thinking would not have happened and I would have been fully capable of doing the work and learning the new job. The anxiety that I was really afraid of and fearing was having to sit still in a cubical all day and not be able to move around and take lots of little breaks like I was and need to do at times even now. It would have been an extremely stressful situation and I somehow knew that at the time. This job was just not a good fit for me and I am glad I chose not too and that was by only luck and just going with an unexplained feeling that I managed to change my mind and not make that choice.
Going back to Liz's husband....the comment about being in charge is incomplete......more like being in control of the situation so he isn't feeling put into a situation that he can't control and doesn't understand the reasons why.
Here are the real reasons for this:
-time distortions that happen when we focus or hyper focus on things in a means to concentrate and not make mistakes and pay attention. All good things but when this happens. Time stands still. Our internal clocks get clicked off and back on again and we are not even aware that this happens. 10 minutes become 30 minutes in reality. This is just a fact that we have to deal with. There's no arguing or making excuses about it because that's a waste of every ones time. Anything stating other wise is a lie on your end....but if you fully believe it's only been 10 minutes and you cannot see that it is 30.....you will keep denying it and saying it's not so. It really is that simple.
What needs to be done here? We have to focus and concentrate on things to get them done and filter out unwanted info in our heads so we don't make mistakes and that is a real ADHD requirement on one hand. Other other hand however....when we do this....time stands still which is another problem that is happening both at the same time. This is also a legitimate reason or explanation of how our executive functioning get screwed up and why this happens. For us....there is no arguing or getting around that either....it's the nuts and bolts of having ADHD.
The problem comes when a person cannot see this happening in themselves and actually recognizes that this is very real and is not something that you can deny. It's a fact just like all other facts of life but there are lots of things you can do to work around this and for it not be such a problem. That's also a fact and it's totally possible to do.
But if you can't see it and right it off immediately and never get to that point.....this will continue to happen until that day comes.
What you the person on the other side of this....do not want to do is what Liz's boss did. Make some comment like he did which is indirect and attached with some kind of label or judgment. Not because it's hurtful or impolite even if it's not said in this way.....it's not speaking directly to the things that I said in a way that either reminds the person that this is happening and you see it.....or gets the person to really see what the problem is in the first place.
The best thing for you to do is be succinct and direct without judgment or personal assessment (incorrectly most of the time when you do this)....and go right to this ADHD issue and recognize it for exactly what it is and make that the focus of everything you say when you are speaking about it. If a person in denial won't listen...that's not your fault even if you do this but at least.....you are standing on firm ground yourself and are being accurate and saying so without self doubt or having to question yourself after the fact especially if the person with ADHD keeps coming up with excuses, lies (in this way...there are different kinds of lying than this that you need to see that way too so you don't get angry over something that a person just can't see) or any other ways to explain it that you know are just not connecting to the actions very well.
Getting a person to see it is the hard part. Once they do and accept it just becomes retraining and working on changing old habits. That's when things will change for the better and you will see a difference when this happens if they are doing there best at learning and trying.
Liz's son is a good example of this. He knows these things about himself and predicts they will happen so he has learned how to avoid them in the first place. The problem is....he still has to deal with the same thing her H does but now when he forced out of his good habits and into his fathers.....it becomes extremely difficult to adapt because he doing all the things he's learned not to do.
In the same sense.....I knew that the job offer I had would put me into a bad situation even when I couldn't explain why. It would have been a bad fit for me because of my ADHD and I would have been hitting up against a lot of problems this would have created for me in order to do things in that way.
I feel for Liz's son because I know what it is like to be put into this position. If you are aware of your ADHD....you know what things to do and what not to do to predict and avoid these problems ahead of time. Even then you will tend to slip on occasion (as I still do ) but it won't completely derail you if that happens.
Without this awareness and understanding or are just in complete denial and cannot see it......you keep stepping the same foot into the same hole every time you get to it.
Best advise here for you on the other side. Know what you are talking about....speak directly and calmly to the problem itself.....and keep pointing to it every time it happens and don't fall off course yourself. If you are doing this....you are speaking the truth, what is real and factual and you are helping the other person see it all at the same time. Anything outside of this on the other side (our side) cannot be taken or seen any other way and eventually.....we will see it too.
That is if a person is willing to take responsibility and willing to take a closer look. You can't can't force someone in denial to do this so it has to be at that point before this will work for them.
I think this right there is the hardest and biggest obstacle to overcome in the first place. Speaking for myself here.....once I did this for myself....the battle now is a downhill fight and is moving right along with improvement over time instead of an uphill fight or worse....running into a brick wall.
J
New enlightenment everyday!
Submitted by I'm So Exhausted on
Hi J,
One reason I participate in the forum, and will continue to participate, is this: what I feel, believe and understand gets validation. I can find it no where else.
I myself have never been able to say my spouse is a liar - as he is not purposely trying to cover up a mis-step or mis-deed. Self preservation is strong. It is what he has to do. This stems from a concept I applied while raising my children - I never pinned them in a corner that would force them to fight in order to preserve themselves. If I KNEW they did something, I addressed it as such. I never put them in the position to chose to lie. Self preservation is an instinct. If I knew it, I would not test them by asking" Did you do such-and-such" or "Do you know who did such-and-such". I chose to be direct. "Mom is very cross that you did such-and-such." or "Doing such-and-such was a poor choice."
I in no way mean to express that I condone this behavior from my spouse. It does give a big piece of insight into why any couple's work we have attempted does not produce the fruit I had hoped would happen. Self preservation in my spouse is very strong.
That said, it is costing LIZ too much. What I know is that I cannot take it. I am searching for viable options so I can choose what is best for me. I will not leave angry. I want to have my options sitting in a row before me so I can choose the best path to go. The only options I had were what I had found or created with the wisdom I have. I now know I need to go to an outside source and look for the options I, at the present moment, do not know exist. Maybe we in fact are bankrupt. Maybe we will not be able to get our heads above water. I honestly do not know.
I attended a Retrouvaille marriage weekend with my spouse earlier this year. I got to see a glimpse of the heart of the man I was attracted to, and a glimpse of the man I know is still in there. That man is trapped/stuck behind a lot of prickles, and barbed wire, and anger. I cannot rescue him from that. Maybe someday he will want to get out. And maybe someday he will find me again. Maybe. Maybe not.
I see the truth in these words you posted:
...........if a person is willing to take responsibility and willing to take a closer look. You can't can't force someone in denial to do this so it has to be at that point before this will work for them.
I think this right there is the hardest and biggest obstacle to overcome in the first place.
I honestly believe I am on the other side. It is a refreshing place to be.
Liz
Self Preservation ie: Cognitive Dissonance
Submitted by kellyj on
Hi Liz,
Thank you so much for bringing this up and reminding me of this. I too get a great deal out of coming to this forum in ways I had not anticipated. One of them just happened in your response to me. I have found that I never now exactly what I will get out of reading the things that are said here and many times it is just reiterating many things that I already know. Nothing wrong with keeping these things fresh in my mind so that in itself is always helpful.
But maybe less often but still not uncommon....I read just one snip-it contained in something that some one writes that really "hits" on something within me. It resonates with me and I resonate as well.....I get a "hit" as I have referred to it and it is that same "little voice" that I was referring to in my last comment when I was talking about changing careers. It is also the reason (now that I mention it) that I have adopted my "kitchen sink" approach in answering and commenting here as well. On one hand....I'm trying to stay on topic and not get too far off field and try and narrow things down since the subject of ADHD and all there is to think about can get really spread out all over the place in a hurry. Trust me on this.....if you only knew the mass of information coming into my head sometimes. Be very,very afraid! Yikes! ha ha
The amount that I actually write is just a fraction or less and it's hard enough to edit it down to just this much already.....and to make this point....I have chosen with some failed attempts already...not to focus on this aspect of my ADHD.... and instead, try and focus on getting the information out there for someone to use and do it in a way that other people can understand which is another problem I run into at times with some people and not with others. One of those happens to be my wife at times and coming here and doing this has proven to be a huge help in doing that for me. Not being succinct and to the point here first....helps me be succinct and too the point with here! lol
Again.....I appreciate every ones patience with my own self indulgence and thanking those who have helped do better with my wife all at the same time. Along with saying this thinking in terms of myself and those snip-its I get myself.....I can't help or stop thinking that someone reading anything I have to say might not get one of those themselves. Is this just an excuse for being long winded or did I just rationalize being a boor to make myself feel better. lol
When you mentioned self preservation....I had a "hit" like I was saying. Whenever this happens now....I pay attention to it every time. These are the little moments that I use to slide on by and now I stop at each one and examine it more closely. This is a pain staking process for me but it is becoming easier for me to do all the time. In part....this has a lot to do with C's comment to me about "over analyzing" things too much which I am fully aware of but to say....before I started doing this....what I did before was ruminate (or stew) endlessly in a negative loop of information or just trying to filter the mass amount that was coming in already at the same time. This proved to get me no where in a hurry and keep me in the same place that I have also been in the past....no where!
So with no further "au due"......self preservation is a form of cognitive dissonance ....and succinctly now.....that is what those "hits" really are. I had completely forgotten about talking about this in my past with my T literally years ago and you just brought this back to mind which has everything to do with what you are talking about. And as I do......I found a great article that explains this very well along with giving some straight up advise in how to overcome the negative aspects of this.
Cognitive dissonance is a major factor in everything that has to do with my ADHD including: processing delays in executive functioning, being long winded, speaking directly and succinctly, verbal processing, selective hearing and memory (filtering and filters), anger, depression, stress, avoidance, anxiety, perception, fear, the ability to stay focused and relate to others better and longer (including my wife) empathy, negative ruminating and emotions.....and in the overall sense of being overwhelmed and mentally tired and exhausted all rolled into one nice neat package. How about that for being succinct?
On the positive side of cognitive dissonance (for me).....it is vital factor for staying motivated and keeping myself level and staying on target including what I said about those "hit's". Those "hit's" means that cognitive dissonance is working but what we do with it is the critical difference between doing the right thing or the wrong thing and all the resulting behaviors that come from the decisions we make that comes out on the other end. The ones that you see and have to deal with for those who are with us ADHD'ers which makes this so difficult for us to be with. I'm including all people with ADHD without knowing this for sure (not being an expert)....but my feelings tell me that I am not the only one where this is a real all encompassing source for many of the issues we have.
Also adding in here.....every human on the planet experiences good and bad cognitive dissonance ADHD or not.....but again, without knowing this as fact....I'm speculating that this is a particular problem for those of us with ADHD. Your comment about your H and self preservation just clued me in on this from the hit that resonated with me when I read it. Having already understood the concept before really helped clue me in here.....Liz....I think whether it was your intention with knowing more from what you have already learned and know......what you observed in your H and what you are calling "self preservation"....is the mother load in explaining so many things when it comes to ADHD and executive functioning issues associated with nearly all the behaviors that I can think of that are directly connected to just ADHD itself.
I might liken it as the gateway to all the other issues that stem from it including most if not all of the co-morbid other disorders and emotional problems that are indirectly associated with having ADHD itself. Possibly?.......the link between these other issues if you were see it from this stand point. I'm forming my opinion based entirely on myself here and have not confirmed any of this as of yet but as I do.....I'm sure I will be reading more on this to try and prove my own personal hypothesis for myself. My gut is leading me in this direction and I feel very strongly that this might be a really good way to explain many of the things that are so bewildering and frustrating for those of you who are with us?
Lastly.....bringing back in the lying and being able to see things or not? Cognitive dissonance can explain those things too.... much better than I have tried with my kitchen sink approach! lol In part....I now know why I have so much difficulty trying to explain this phenomenon without using stories or examples. To activate it or make use of cognitive dissonance......you need to involve the combination of emotions, knowledge and experiences in order for it to work. Call it a gut feeling if you like but it is in it's essence.....explaining this too. That's a complex and complicated thing to try and describe or relate to with someone else and to make this point here for you now.....
I rambled on and was kind of long winded on purpose so you can go to this link and see exactly why I did this and bring in with it all the things that I said. I'm not entirely and word flooding Space Cadet without some reason behind it....at least not always! That is the hard part to tell and why you should not speculate or access everything being associated with ADHD. The same thing at times can be....or can not be....but only the person who has it can tell you if this is true. That is if they are aware of everything I just said:)
Here's the link: link edited out - against posting rules
Liz...the thing you said....... I in no way mean to express that I condone this behavior from my spouse. It does give a big piece of insight into why any couple's work we have attempted does not produce the fruit I had hoped would happen. Self preservation in my spouse is very strong. Is the thing that caused this "hit" with me.
Like I said.....I think you hit the mother load! lol
J
Some Helpful Steps to Take...More Cognitive Dissonance
Submitted by kellyj on
I thought it might be useful for those who are interested to post the steps from the article I just included in my last comment. Personally.....I really like these for myself and intend to copy and post it on my white board as a reminder.
side note: I was scrounging the other day at a resale materials recycling outlet and found 6 more whiteboards with nice aluminum frames for $5 a piece (5ft X 4ft). Now I just have to find a place to put them! Remembering the movie " A Beautiful Mind" with Russel Crow and his post it notes all over the walls and ceilings. I'm not hearing voices (yet lol)....but I can definitely relate to that much at least. lol
The solution to this problem is relatively simple: ‘re-train’ yourself such that you recognize those situations wherein the experience of some fear, anxiety, and negative feelings or emotions are expected and acceptable to you. By doing so, you will be less likely to work against your own progress because you will be less likely to misuse psychological self-preservation in these types of situations.
Here is an example of how you might do this using the skipped gym session and gluttonous beverage consumption example from above:
1.Identify the potential behaviors you are considering: You get the first thought of skipping the gym and bee-lining to the nearest java-hut.
2. Be honest with yourself about your desires: Admit to yourself that, yes, you do want that delicious beverage, and that, yes, you would like to skip the gym today.
3. Recognize and accept that you may experience some negative feelings or emotions: Tell yourself that you know you will feel disappointed if you don’t have that beverage and that you might have less positive feelings in the gym today – BUT that you are ok with that.
4. Evaluate the behaviors relative to ‘who you are’ or ‘who you are trying to be’: Remind yourself that not having that beverage and making it to the gym are more consistent with ‘who you are’ or ‘who you are trying to be’.
Steps 3 and 4 are crucial to this re-training process because these two steps are sometimes left out of our conscious decision-making process, particularly when the intensity of desire (step 2) is high.
This strategy to battle misuse of psychological self-preservation seems simple, doesn’t it? That is because it is. The key to effective cognitive-behavioral intervention is that it is theoretically sound, simple, and realistic.
All that is left now is for you to give it a try!
Remember: the key to any effective behavioral change strategy is consistency. That means being diligent and honest in identifying those times where you are prone to misusing psychological self-preservation.
It may start off feeling a bit awkward – having to pause and remind yourself of the steps – but as time goes on and you repeat these new decision-making behaviors consistently, you will find that you will adopt this new way of behavioral decision-making.
As a result, you will more-frequently make those behavioral choices that will help you move forward toward your personal health and wellness goals!
Keep on pluggin’!
This is a good example of what I have been doing already but not being able to describe it as simply as this. This is in it's very essence....the over analyzing part that I have been trying to adopt and master as a replacement for all the negative aspects associated with this in my past. I have already discovered really only one down side to this but it is easy to with my wife and that has not been a probably lately. Keep it to myself and don't say it or verbal process out loud!! I found that without realizing it.....this is what I was doing with her in the same room with me and no one wants to actually hear yourself doing it.....including me! lol
here's the link again http://peakwellnessonline.com/why-we-can-sometimes-be-our-own-worst-enem...
An example was when he went to automotive technical school after
Submitted by overwhelmedwife on
>> An example was when he went to automotive technical school after high school graduation. The school had strict guidelines - shirt must be tucked in - no hair on hanging on shirt collars - and a real biggie - school started at 8 am. The front doors got LOCKED at 8:10. If you were late, you missed school for that day. Our son had an hour drive to school. He would get up at 5. Make breakfast. Watch some TV. Get himself into the day - and leave for school. He was never late. >>>
It's funny how when it's a situation where there is an unbending deadline, they can make it. My mother-in-law did miss a plane one time, but never after that. However, she was consistently VERY late for weddings, parties, her own anniversary party, etc.....because there was no "locked door" preventing a late arrival.
My brother-in-law is rudely late, VERY LATE, to everything, except COURT (he's a lawyer). He knows that he would get into trouble by the judge if he were late. Again, when the punishment is high enough (locked out/contempt of court), they can get their acts together.
As I mentioned before, my father in law started his own business so no one would get on his case about being late or whatever.
A year ago, I hired a handyman to do some repairs at my business. He'd show up around 10:30!! then go to lunch at 11:30, then come back around 1pm, and then around 2pm, he'd tell me that he had to leave for some "made up" reason. I finally confronted him and asked him why he couldn't get there at 8 am or at least each before he arrived at 10:30 so that he wouldn't have to leave for lunch an hour later. He gave the BS excuse of "not working for anyone, being his own boss, etc." I fired him.
Yes! Structure vs Needing to Do Things Our Way
Submitted by kellyj on
People with ADHD need structure!! I need it and cannot live without it. On my own (working for myself) I have to constantly remind myself of this or things start falling apart rapidly. "Murphy's Law" and "Best Laid Plans" multiply X 10 for people with ADHD. Speaking from this experience.....these are my words not ones I read somewhere else. Without an imposed structure like you are talking about.....we need external cues up the yin yang! Without those.....you need to rely on other people to this for you. Not so good in my mind. That's a critical error in thinking with ADHD.
The external cues take the place of my wife having to do this for me. I also get to decide and choose which ones will work for me and how I need to set them up so they will work. That's killing two birds with one stone. Recalling one of my stand bye rules to use as a default to use as a guide for me. Sometimes....the wisest words come from unexpected place.
Case in point.....my dear friend "William Handley" (his name changed here for his privacy). William....discovered this rule from his experiences while he was attending college many years ago with having more than one run in with drinking and driving and getting caught in doing so.
But I will always remember his mantra and conclusion to these events which has now become a universal law as such between our friends. This has now become "William Handley's Universal Law"....which states........
Never break two laws at the same time. For example........if you are going to drink and drive.....make sure your tail lights all work and you don't speed or run stop signs. One or the other....but never both at the same time.
In our dear friends somewhat misguided logic at the time.....I think he quite possibly came up with one of the better laws to follow in general in reality. It seems to work no matter which way you apply and it is simple and easy to remember. lol
When it comes to having structure or needing to do things "Our Way"......using William Handley's Law as a means to make these decisions I think not only applies....but is a critical mistake not to consider in all things like this having ADHD.
You think I'm just trying to be funny? ha ha I'm serious.....it really works! Don't knock it until you try it! lol :)
Ironically......Mr Handley also has ADHD.....what a surprise....coming from the mouth of babes! lol
J
People with ADHD need structure!! I need it and cannot live wit
Submitted by overwhelmedwife on
<<<
People with ADHD need structure!! I need it and cannot live without it.
<<<
Since there was a time when it was believed that boys, starting at a VERY young age, needed structure and routines. That was probably an early proactive approach to ADHD when not as much was known about it....but it was known that structure and routine, "work before play" mantras, worked.
I think that when young children, particularly ones potentially with ADHD, grow up with strict (but not crazy strict) schedules (wake up, grooming, dress, eat, and go) it deters and overcomes a lot of the dawdling and distractions that cause ADHD folks to be chronically late.
A friend of mine, who probably would have had the more annoying ADHD problems, was raised with a firm (but not crazy) WORK BEFORE PLAY mantra. It was like a religion. And it paid off in dividends.
It seems now that there is more of a "whatever makes you happy" attitude with child-rearing. Routines aren't well-developed and no one seems to be "minding the store."
Anyone old enough to remember the book and movie called, "Cheaper By the Dozen"? The book featured a family with 12 kids, and the parents were "efficiency experts" (future industrial engineers).
The parents knew that the only solution was strict routines, limited shower time, etc.
While likely some of their kids probably did have the organic aspects of ADHD, the routine, work before play philosophy prevented a lot of the "laziness" associated with ADHD.
Structure and routines cure a lot of ills associated with Executive Function Disorder.
When you read about typical ADHD lateness and other issues, it's seems obvious that these weren't people who were raised with structure. They'll goof off looking at their phones, taking long showers, etc, and then are (surprise) they're late again.
Wow.. . . . Really?
Submitted by I'm So Exhausted on
overwhelmedwife,
"When you read about typical ADHD lateness and other issues, it's seems obvious that these weren't people who were raised with structure. They'll goof off looking at their phones, taking long showers, etc, and then are (surprise) they're late again. "
".....work before play philosophy prevented a lot of the "laziness" associated with ADHD".
Some of these sorts of judgments are just ruffling my senses. Why paint a person with ADHD with such a wide brush of judgments that do not address any positive solutions? It fits into that stereotypical belief “If Johnny would just try harder…he has so much untapped potential…" —implying that, unlike you and me, Johnny doesn't care whether he succeeds or fails. Or that he is simply lazy. .
Ouch.
Liz
I think you misunderstood...
Submitted by overwhelmedwife on
It's not about "trying harder". It's about child rearing in a way that helps mitigate some of the more negative aspects of ADHD.
I Agree OW
Submitted by kellyj on
Despite the negative aspects of my childhood experience with strict parents and a father who...for all intensive purposes was a drill Sergeant....there was an up side to this and it the very things that you have said......done in a different way hopefully!!! lol
As you mentioned.....this is talking about child rearing and kids with ADHD. Structure was then and still is now my saving grace. The sports that I competed in was more of the same thing. All good things for kids with ADHD.
J
Right....
Submitted by overwhelmedwife on
And it has to start at a very young age. Not started when kids are in school, and the problems are already severe. That's often too late.
My mom, who was very loving, was also a "drill sergeant". There would never have been any "sleeping in" or anything like that. She grew up poor and on a farm, and the mentality at a very young age was....you get up early, you feed the animals, you do chores, you THEN GET TO eat.
During the rest of the day, you helped out in age-appropriate ways, and you did get to play, and then help with evening obligations.. Once she was school-aged, then that was added to the mix, but still all the home/farm chores existed and became more complex as she aged.
From a very young age, organization is taught. From a very young age, the idea of "I'm not going to get to eat until the chickens are fed and the eggs are collected" is imprinted into the brain. An order of doing things is taught. Logic is taught. Walking around smarts are taught.
It may shock some people, but chores begin around age 2. What?? Yes. Ok, you're undressing yourself, now put your dirty clothes in the hamper. Good. Ok, you're taking your PJ's off, put them under your pillow for tonight. Ok, you're done playing with your Legos, pick them up and put them into the box.
Help mommy separate the wash. Put the white dirty clothes in a pile. Put the colored clothes in a pile. (I have to lol about this. One of my sons does have slight ADHD (may have been worse if I hadn't been firm with him), and, he's appalled by friends who don't sort their laundry. lol),
Hands-on parenting. Parenting from afar or from the next room doesn't cut it.
Just wanted to add.....
Submitted by overwhelmedwife on
There are times that I feel that I have a mild form of ADHD....some hyper-focus and sometimes a lousy short-term memory. I'll go into a supermarket for - say - eggs, but as I'm walking towards the Dairy area, something will catch my eye and distract me. I'll pick up something, maybe find a few other things that I also needed, and then forget to buy the eggs! lol
So....Because of this, I need and benefit from routines. I have an older dog who absolutely needs two medications given to him (one by injection) twice a day - right after eating. I also have one older cat that only stays in one room to avoid a puppy that "bothers her". So she needs to be fed twice a day and given a med after her meal as well in that area of the house, as well. These meds cannot be missed.
If I didn't have a strict morning and evening routine, I can assure you that I would "forget" or "miss" something. I have a set "do not deviate" routine. Change their water, make up their food bowls, bring the the older cat her food and water in the area that she stays.....and give her meds. Then, make up the injection for older dog, and give him the shot. Then, give him his pills. Put all meds away (one must be refrigerated).
I can't afford to mess up anything. I can't forget meds for older cat and older dog. I can't forget the older cat that stays in another area. I can't forget to clean/replace water. and I can't forget to put one Rx back in the fridge. Then I have to repeat in the evening.
I also can't afford to accidentally drop/break the refrigerated med (in glass bottle), so I keep it in a padded bag in the fridge and I open it and keep it on the table. I don't walk around with just the bare bottle. This way if I were to drop it, it would be on the table and not break. While walking with it, it is in the padded bag for protection if dropped. It's expensive, so I wouldn't want to drop it . H has done that and now he's learned my method.
So, I do not deviate from The Routine. It's like Hard-Wired now. I've been doing this for 2 years. It's like the wake up, shower, dress, eat and groom/brush teeth routine that many of us automatically have from childhood.
When my kids started school, we had to have a strict morning routine, which we nicknamed, "The Whole Nine Yards"....at that time, kids bathed at night, so it was Dress, eat, comb hair, brush teeth, go to backdoor, grab backpack and go to car. In the afternoon/evenings, it was: Do homework, put books/papers in backpack and put by back door, Dinner, help clean up, watch some TV, bath, brush teeth, go to bed.
Many who play in organized sports are used to routines....and used to "consequences" when rules aren't followed or when uniforms are left at home......"run 5 laps" or "do 10 push-ups"
Routines are what the military use to overcome "forgetfulness" or distractions.
Whew!
Submitted by I'm So Exhausted on
overwhelmedwife,
I believe that routines and schedules are wonderful.. Wonderful!
Certainly being prepared in advance, getting clothes and supplies prepared the night before, have clearly defined expectations of the day, are no doubt a way for everyone to feel secure; to know what to expect; spelled out in easy to understand terms, so there is no doubt about it.
Sports coaches have their athletes for a short amount of time. They have no room for wasting time. Military. . .well, yes indeed routines are surely incorporated. So everyone is on the same page. My home is not a boot camp. Nor a military division of any sort.
I am a Mom. I want my home to be the place of safety. A soft place to fall. A place where love is unconditional. Rules are meant to be followed. And humanness is what guides those rules. We cannot be perfect. We have to determine what has room for a bit of give, and what does not - like medicine schedules.
When do expectations exceed abilities and need to be adjusted? Don't know who said these words, but they are WISDOM: Everybody is a Genius. But If You Judge a Fish by Its Ability to Climb a Tree, It Will Live Its Whole Life Believing that It is Stupid.
We all forget stuff. I went to the bank, and forgot the deposit on my desk at home. I went to the store for three things, didn't write them down, and forgot one. I get into the basement, and forget what I ran down there fore. I go to put something away, and get distracted from my cleaning by some other job that I came across. These are call humanness. We can laugh at ourselves, or we can wring our hands in frustration when something goes amiss.
As I read what you have written, I began to see bits of myself. How I tried to overcompensate what I "expected" from my spouse and did not receive. And in the end, I tried to do it all and became. . . . . yep, Ta Dah: I'm So Exhausted.
It takes so mch time and effort to not deviate from a routine. And it stresses our children out. They need to know they might slip up . . .and it will be ok, and they can try again tomorrow.
Balance. Everything in balance. Not too lax, or when you give an inch they just might take a mile. There is really always tomorrow. . . .a whole new day, and as Anne Shirley of Green Gables said, in Lucy Maude Montgomery's books, “Isn't it nice to think that tomorrow is a new day with no mistakes in it yet?”
What I realized I did not have as my children were growing up was a man to co-parent with me - My children love us both. My spouse was a great Dad, fun, creative. Where he had short-comings, I had strengths. Mom doled out consequences. Mom set the boundaries. Mom tried to have some sort of semblance as I fought against my spouse's Fly-By-The-Seat-Of-His-Pants Scheduling. We had set bedtimes. We had a set suppertime. 75% of the time, Daddy was still on a job. It just was. Inside it killed me - at the time - I yearned for suppertime together. My children, they had no clue. It was just how it was. They knew no different. I am sure they heard me grumble sometimes about how Daddy said he would be home on time, but I will have to ask if they heard that all the time or not. I believe they did not.
So indeed I set the rules, drove them to and from school and activities. Did the housework, and groceries, and laundry, and ran the administrative end of the construction business. And, tried to Be The Wife of a Happy Husband.
Whew.
Now I know better, so I do better.
Liz
This is one where I will agree to disagree.
Submitted by I'm So Exhausted on
overwhelmedwife,
What I read in your post, is what I experienced with my son in school. I was just learning about ADHD. I had several teachers approach us with "THE answer' to help my son.
LOL. One teacher stated all my son needed was a 'stress ball' to have in his hand and manipulate. That would WORK! This teacher KNEW it would be the answer. It didn't even take one day before that stress ball was burst, and what ever was inside to make it squishy- - it was all over my son's desk, and the floor, and the classroom.
There is not just ONE answer. There are a multitude of things we can try, and if successful, we can shout Huzzah! If not, then on to the next thing. I can share some things that worked with my son. I can share some things that did not work.
He also had a teacher who was going to "teach" him organization, with a big ol' binder and colored folders and dividers, etc. By the end of the year, she was frustrated, my son was frustrated. His binder looked like hell, and he cried. . . because it did not work - - for him. No matter how hard that teacher pushed, and tried and got frustrated, she was trying to make something work for a child that he could not apply to his life. And he was left wondering what was wrong with him. I didn't like his black hole of a back pack. It weighted a ton. Yet, when push came to shove, It worked for him.
Truly I believe that since we knew and learned about my son's ADHD at an early age, we were able to learn along with him, and discover new approaches to make his life wonderful and help him discover what his strengths were and what he needed help with. Do what you are good at, ask help for what you are not.
Liz
It only becomes a problem when it affects your life
Submitted by I'm So Exhausted on
overwhelmedwife,
I think Liz's own ability to get up and moving is related to where I need to be. I CAN, but sometimes I do not choose to! When I have a responsibility - be at work, be at school, be at my parents' house to take them to doctor's appointments - I can get up, dressed, out the door, and on my way. When I have nothing on my agenda, I can easily still be in my PJs, sipping coffee, lolling around the house at 2 pm. As with anyone, I can be late sometimes, but it is not having a negative impact on my life as related to being with others and keeping up with my own responsibilities.
My point is that having those rules imposed on my son, worked for him. Those sort of rules work against my spouse - or he maybe fights against them. The bottom line here is Liz truly believes that for what ever reason, my spouse 'can not.' It is not simply he 'will not.' Thus he does not identify with me when I try to get to the place where we can formulize a schedule that I respect, and he respects - mutual satisfaction.
I had a real "Ah Ha" moment yesterday. I was talking with my brother about what Liz sees when she looks at her spouse - as related to his current life struggles. His general appearance is unkemp, sullen a lot, angry, and sad. My brother sees that too. As do many people who care about my spouse. Yet my spouse does not see it. Or maybe he does! He chooses to stay away and isolate himself so he can keep his pain hidden - or so he thinks.
In the midst of my anorexia/bulimia in my 20s, I was skinny as a rail - with a big ol' smile plastered on my face. My body was clearly shouting out "Can't you see how much pain I am in?" yet I denied it. I WANTED to be happy, wonderful, helpful, ready to save the world. What my physical appearance told people was a far cry from what I claimed.
And while I certainly have empathy for my spouse, I resent the fact that I while took all the responsibility for my issues, my spouse clearly blames most of his anger/sadness/bitterness in our marriage on me, and most of his anger sadness/bitterness in his life on everyone else. I did not blame everyone else. I knew something was amiss, and struggled to figure out why I could not get my life right. It did take a log time to address and correct the problem. I did get a victory and was able turn my life around from being stuck in eating disorders.
I have really become fed up with feeling like my spouse still keeps me locked in that prison, continually letting me know he thinks there is something wrong with me, and until I face my own demons, we can never have a happy marriage. Ugh. I have removed myself from the scape-goat/whipping-girl position. After years trying to "make" my husband happy, and follow guidance to "Be the wife of a happy husband", this gal has had enough. I cannot do it, and I ain't trying no more!!!!!!
So, I think this post may have traveled around Robin Hood's barn and back, but I am leaving it as it is :)
And to You Liz...
Submitted by kellyj on
in connection to what you were saying.....yes.....as I found with my father who would not going to change and was so firmly rooted in being just one way only. There are people like this too. I already commented earlier that my mother had come to this conclusion her self and at that point....she knew what to expect and could plan her life accordingly. I am not this way (more like your son perhaps?) ..but there are those people who are not.....and nothing between heaven and earth is going to make a difference or change them no mater what you do. Pounding your head up a brick wall continually is not going to make a difference either way so fighting a losing battle on your end will only have the results that you have already discovered.....the same as I did. Stop fighting that battle is the only thing you can do and work on yourself. Pretty much what I did too. What else can you do if this is the case?
There is a point where.....if you need to cut your losses and you keep investing in a sinking ship....that really is a failure on your part not the ship that sinking? (not implying that your H is a sinking ship....it's just a metaphor:)
Working on yourself and focusing your energies in that direction is investing in yourself instead as you read this metaphor correctly. This isn't saying to give up on him or your marriage.....it's just saying to look at him differently and being realistic in your expectations without any wishful thinking or hopeful optimism that will only lead to disappointment. I think that's a good way to say it......to stop being continually disappointed and feeling poorly because of it when your own expectations are never fulfilled.
Thinking in terms of my mother's critical error in her thinking and in her own life with this scenario......she reached the place when my father passed away....that she had lost the ability to do things for herself and she was completely lost without someone to take care of and keep doing the same thing she did before. That's something to consider here and something that you want to avoid at all cost. Back to working and improving things for yourself and focusing on those things that will bring you do other things that you enjoy and bring you happiness what ever they are? You can't go wrong there.
J
The good place I am at
Submitted by I'm So Exhausted on
J,
I like the place I am. And I will continue to find the answers that I need.
For years my life's mantra was - make my marriage good, make my marriage work, change, change change, to meet other's expectations.
Now I know better, and I do better. I also look at the financial situation I have, the place I participated to get to, and I want to make the best choices for Liz. The temptation to run is strong. I will not do that. I am building my own future. There are no guarantees, but at least I know if something does not work, it is because it wasn't the right choice and I will try something different. It will not be because 'there is something wrong with Liz, and as soon as she gets straightened out her marriage will then work.'
As for being part of a sinking ship, I honestly may be. That is why I need to find a financial expert to look at what we have and help me see if I am trying to fight a losing battle. I do not believe in bankruptcy. We made all these bills, we need to pay what we owe. And. . .. maybe I really need to adjust my thinking on that?!
I am here because of choices Liz made. I am going in a different direction because of choices Liz is making. . . . .for her. Liz. A fine lady and a daughter of The King.
Liz