Hi All,
I am posting my story in hope that someone may be able to provide some guidance and words of wisdom?
My wife has recently been diagnosed by a psychologist with ADHD.
Together: 16 years (Married 11 years)
Children x 2 under 6
Announced Jan 2022 that she was done with the relationship
Brief History
In Oct 2022 my wife also told me she thought she has ADHD which I initially reacted poorly to and said we could fix things. Once she told me how angry this made her. I threw myself into helping her and reading everything I could and I came to agree with her. She has since seen a Psychologist who after consultation, stated that in her clinical opinion it is highly likely my wife has ADHD.
Relationship issues
- Our difficulties got worse after our first child in 2017. It was a very stressful pregnancy and my wife had many complications with a risk of fatality due to bleeding out. I was lucky enough to attend every appointment as I was so worried.
- My wife began to withdraw from that point, albeit slowly. She also expressed at points she felt she was struggling to bond with our children.
- We appear to have a very codependent relationship (I certainly feel I have become codependent) which I believe I have enabled over the years with me being the main cook, cleaner, organiser, planner and the one responsible for finances.
- Although I have expressed burnout over the years and tried to encourage her getting involved she never did. This led to me feeling overburdened and at times fostered resentment in me.
- However since the revelation of ADHD, this fits and I feel bad and guilty about the way I handled things. Although I have read in ADHD forums, undiagnosed ADHD can play havoc in a marriage and a parent-child dynamic is common.
- I became hyper-organised and frugal to counter the situation, in my mind preparing for a future. My idea being we could pay off the house and within 5 years and save for our children’s and our future. My wife disagreed with this as she said she never had anything growing up and so our children would be OK.
- I am an affectionate person and so my wife withdrawing was difficult and I was always open and honest that it made me feel lonely and unloved and I asked her how I could make sure she felt loved.
- The common theme around this is our communication lines were never open. I was always happy to talk about alternatives but my wife only expressed disagreement but when asked what she would like instead always replied with “I don’t know.”
- I feel my wife basically completely gave up in October 2022
To date
Trying to find a way forward talking my my W she said she feels we don’t need any professional help and just need to ‘sit down and talk.’ I calmly stated that ‘i feel’ that we have always tried to do this in th past and it has never worked and so I feel we need some professional help. She said she thought couples therapy was helpful to me as she felt "I realized the error of my ways", no reference to any self reflection on her behalf. My wife said she does not want to go to the workshop as she feels I am trying to manipulate her into it.
She referenced my apology letter and said that I am so controlling and manipulated decisions in our lives over the years. This breaks my heart as I am very aware of this however in my defense it some extent I have had no choice as my W has never been able to make or contribute to decisions (ADHD consequence?) ans so I had no choice but to pick up the mantle. However I did not try to defend myself (as I have learned this only makes things worse) and only stated that I acknowledge she feels the outcomes of decisions made her feel controlled I never had any ill intention and always acted in a way I thought was in our families best interests (confusingly she said she tells people what a good man I am and told our therapist I am a good husband and father)
Summary
Although my wife acknowledges her ADHD and takes comfort in the fact it explains many situations in her past, poor grades at school, failing to pay vital bills, lying about attending important appointments etc when it comes to our relationship she has a block and believes whole heartedly that I am the cause of all her unhappiness and relationship issues. This is despite my W and I going through the following article and agreeing together on all of the points:
https://www.additudemag.com/is-adhd-threatening-your-relationship/
My W does not wish to go on medication yet has not made no attempt at employing or exploring any coping strategies. I do not believe she has pursued any further IC either.
I still love my wife dearly and my heart aches for her as much I am truly hurt myself. I feel she is pushing me away on purpose and categorically doesn't want to work on our relationship yet avoids dealing with any problems. It's like she is living in a bubble. I fear for our children too and seek some stability for the future. However at present my W is not willing to consider that she has any accountability or contribution to her current state of unhappiness and our relationship issues. She says that ‘feelings cannot change.’
I just don't know what to do next. My wife is not a reader nor will she listen to and self help audiobooks/podcasts nor seek our webinars/seminars.
My W sees the only solution to our currently situation is to break up our family and for us to separate despite not really putting any work in to try to resolve our issues (she has said we have tried everything although has even admitted that sometimes she thinks about things so much she convinces herself she has actually actioned them).
Any guidance is much appreciated as I really do not know what to do next.
Wow a lot of details there, good stuff
Submitted by Non-ADHD-Hubby on
Wow a lot of details there, good stuff. I get the feeling you and I are fairly similar...a little OCD perhaps! Can make for a difficult coexistence with an ADHD partner. Being as that she went undiagnosed for so long and that you more than likely were both confused as to why you could never get along/why strange things kept happening, I would take a step back and try and take it easy on yourselves.
You having educated yourself on ADHD is a good thing, however you need to educate yourselves together. If she is unwilling to dive in then it will be difficult to start healing. The journey is hard requiring 110% commitment, and while you both will continue to face challenges relating to ADHD throughout the rest of your relationship, it will be much more amicable, forgiving, and loving.
In the case of my wife and I, the trials and tribulations have brought us closer together, solidifying a foundation built on love and caring. We still go at it from time to time (although less as the years pass), and I am sure her symptoms are as frustrating to her as they are to me, and she seems to feel the same about my situation, however this dichotomy invokes something very important, sympathy. I feel like I am pretty much an ADHD champion having gotten to a good place with my wife, as well as with my two daughters who are both ADHD as well, and sympathy has had a lot to do with that.
Lastly, and possibly just as important as what I've already laid out, you need to take care of yourself, and from your detailed post it would seem that there is not much time in your life to do so. Don't be too hard on yourself and take breaks where your wife is not involved. Might take her some getting used to but hopefully the eventual shift in your mood resulting from this "time out" will convince her of the importance the role of self care has in the journey.
Anyway hope my insight helps, and that you can both work together, Melissa's books and courses are a great start, as is finding an ADHD-specialized counselor that can also be helpful along the healing journey.
Anger & Denial
Submitted by t2l on
Hi Non-ADHD-Hubby, thank you for taking the time to respond. I have read thoroughly The ADHD Effect on Marriage and like most other people it is like Melissa was a fly on the wall in our life. Interestingly one of my Wife's good friends sent her an ADHD documentary that my Wife then told me about. I watched it and used it as a springboard to tell her about The ADHD Effect on Marriage book and asked if it was OK if I shared my copy with her. She instantly responded to say that I know she won't read it. I brought it down and gave it to her all the same.
My Wife has been trying to get me to make big decisions RE: our finances, property and other assets to move separation forward (she keeps referring to it as 'our' separation however I feel it is 'her' separation as it is not what I want and feel given all the info in Melissa's book we have so much scope to grow and rebuild) which I have responded to say I need to think about these things. In all honesty 1) these are life changing decisions for me, my W and our young children 2) having been accused of being manipulative/controlling (we are deep in the Parent/Child trap); I told her I did not feel able to make these decisions given my emotional state and current understanding of our dynamic and that I wanted to avoid past mistakes I have made. It is frustrating as in one moment I am told I have been so controlling over the years and this was terrible for my Wife but then in the same breath she is asking me to be responsible for these decisions which are not what I want but what she wants.
Given this I forwarded two clips from interviews with Melissa which concisely explains the parent/child dynamic, what is is, how it occurs, how the non-ADHD spouse does NOT want to be in control but can at times be forced into that and how it can be broken. They were very balanced explaining how both spouses contribute to this dynamic. Her reply was that she agreed this was our dynamic however then proceeded to ask for an update on my responses to these decisions she wants me to make to help the separation.
Today she left her phone in our car in an ADHD rush of a morning having stayed up in hyper focus on her hobby until past 2am. So when I finally noticed her phone calls after doing all the other responsibilities of the morning, I arranged to meet to return her phone.
I used this as an opportunity to for us to walk and talk (I read walking and talking is helpful for those with ADHD) and opened up about my concerns about her mental and physical health. She did not appear to take this well and started to accuse me of telling all her friends she is 'sick.' I explained that I had not spoken to any of her friends which she then acknowledged and moved swiftly on. During the rest of the conversation she continued to vacillate between ADHD having no impact on her and since she must have had it all her life she concluded that the problems are me and our relationship, NOT ADHD. Then she would explain she did something a certain way or is challenged due to her ADHD. She is convinced one of our daughters has ADHD too (to which I agree).
She just kep returning to the fact that I have been controlling and manipulative but can only see the parent/child dynamic as me being a participant and only her as an observer. She appears to feel she played no part in this dynamic. From her words and emotions she cannot at this time get past that hurt and pain nor forgive my (re)actions. I have taken accountability for my contribution (I truly feel regret, shame and guilt for my part in the parent/child trap) and avoided blaming my Wife (I feel she needs to be responsible for acknowledging her own accountability and not be told it by someone else).
I can't deny that it is not hurtful to have someone that you have loved for 17 years (and despite all the anger I still love the same amount if not more to this day) hold what feels such resentment over me however I worry decisions she is making now in the throws of heightened emotions and unprocessed anger will come back and haunt both us and our entire family in the future.
Am I in the wrong here? I am happy to be challenged. My best and most supportive friends continue to challenge me and not just agree with me. A quote i liked from another support group (I unfortunately cannot remember who posted it nor who coined it) is:
"A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice. A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you"
I feel my Wife is in complete denial. I feel selfish to want forgiveness and understand that is not up to me. I have previously apologized for my contribution to our relationship issues and my Wife said she 'forgives me' but the situation remains the same, 'too much damage has been done" and "too little too late." That does not feel like I have been forgiven.
How do I break through the denial, even if for understanding and communication going forwards for the sake of our children? I feel a bit deflated today :-(
-t2l
Of course! I find it helpful
Submitted by Non-ADHD-Hubby on
Of course! I find it helpful for me as well reflecting on my journey...picks me up when I am down.
You know what? From what I have read you are a great husband and father. If your wife sees that through the ADHD fog than I cannot imagine why she would choose to lose you.
In the end, ADHD or not, we just want to be loved, appreciated, and supported. While such opportunities might not have been present prior with you/her, your are putting them on the table for her now. If she can stop looking into the past and focus on what is in front of her now there's no reason for her not to see this.
Perhaps let the dust settle for a bit by taking some time for yourself. Don't feel guilty about this, your kids will be fine, some spinning plates might hit the floor without your diligent cushioning, and your wife may resent your new "self indulgence" and passiveness with regards to your non-response to her separation queries, but eventually things will settle. This will remove the toxic parent-child dynamic, and most of the resent, creating the environment needed for healing.
It will also facilitate the 110% commitment needed by you and your wife. You seem to be both at the precipice of your ADHD journey, and if you get through this moment, there will still be difficult times ahead: acknowledging both your roles in the parent-child dynamic, her possible post partum and its effect on things, rebuilding trust, learning how to manage ADHD symptoms, etc. All totally doable though in a healthy environment if you're both committed.
Whether this keeps the separation from moving forward or not, I see no better lesson to pass along to your kids then the example you would be setting.
The ADHD partner has to want to improve
Submitted by 1Melody1 on
Unfortunately, as clearly as we can see the issues as non partners, most of the work needs to come from the partner with ADHD in the form of medication and coaching/therapy. Without their effort, nothing will change. My ex husband was much like your wife in that he would rather lose his family than address the ADHD. I don't know if it helps, but I'm now on the other side raising a healthy, well-adjusted daughter as a single mom in a clean environment with no dysfunction in the house. It's a relief for both of us. My ex is happier too. He could not be accountable to others and is happy he no longer has to try to be.
I know it's hard. I spent a good decade trying to get my husband to take action so we could save the marriage. I could have spent several more with the same end result: Nothing. It has to come from them and that REALLY sucks for us.
She's blaming the wrong person. You are taking way too much accountability for the problems here imo. She won't even make the effort to read a book (my husband got to page 8 in Melissa's book and dropped it - I get what you're up against). If we can't even get them to turn a page, how are any of the big changes going to happen?? It's crazy-making.
I know you want to save it. A lot of this is in her hands, unfortunately. I hope you find a way through and if you don't, just know that there can be blissful sanity on the other side and a couple years from now you might even be happier. ♥️
RE: 1Melody1
Submitted by t2l on
Thank you 1Melody1 for your honest account. It is good to hear different experiences. It must have been exceptionally difficult for you over the years so thank you for sharing. I just cannot fathom losing so much without at least trying. The entry fee really is so low for the knowledge but you stand to loose so much more by running and avoiding.
At the moment it feels this way that there is such complete denial. It feels like most situations are non-ADHD spouse lwaving the ADHD spouse. I get that it is so hard to break through and self reflect. I have been there. In fact I am still there right now. I feel tortured some days by my values and really want to set the best example for my children in the future. I am aware I have become codependent and overfunctioned.
As much as I try and learn about ADHD, it is one thing to be able to recite facts but to fully understand and accept appears to be a different kettle of fish. My heart does feel truly broken.
-t2l
I am on the other side
Submitted by T00T00 on
I am the non-ADHD wife who wants to separate. I told my husband "the reason why I am trying to like you now is because of your steadfast love."
Do the both of you know what your love language is? Maybe find out together (take the quiz together) & try it out everyday. It might just start with you but hopefully after time pass (goal is 1-2 years), she might try it out too.
I try to speak for less than 15 minutes with my husband & do something else (while sitting together) or just sit/stare in silence together (take a break).
What did you both do during 5 years being together before marriage? My coworker told me to date my husband.
I have post-partum problems after birth. It takes a long time to heal & I didn't heal properly. Please check if your wife has it.
She acknowledge your efforts by saying it to others. Maybe she wants to be acknowledge (even as little effort) by your words spoken to herself/others???
I self-taught myself to learn how to leave things as a mystery. I pick & choose my battles now because it's exhausting to insist or problem-solve. I used to bring the counseling to my husband (since he didn't want to go to marriage counseling).
I pick up the mantle less & let my husband do something (small or big) even if it has a consequence. We are both adults & are capable of taking care of ourselves in our own time. I just make sure it's a consequence I can handle, so I just leave it alone at the moment. i.e. not doing laundry, not doing dishes, letting him order takeout, I order takeout, etc.
RE: TS0000
Submitted by t2l on
Hi TS0000, thank you for taking the time to respond.
If I understand 'steadfast love' correctly I feel that aligns well with my beliefs and values. I am not religious (perhaps at present you would say I am agnostic?) however I feel very strongly about my wedding vows. They in themselves describe to me any such day in existence, I mean after good days, bad days, richer, poorer, in sickness and in health; what days are left? I feel I made those vows for a reason so I currently stand by those vows and no matter how much hurt and pain I feel, my love is still as strong for my wife. I know that the parent/child dynamic is hugely toxic and as mentioned in previous replies I acknowledge the pain and hurt I know I have caused my wife in my reactions. As much as it is comforting that this is a common dynamic it still does not change the fact that this feeling was caused. Those were bad days. We are still in bad days. However this was not a clause in our vows to give up after so many bad days. As much as I have felt resentment myself in the past before understanding our dynamics and what has likely lead us to this place. I stand steadfast for my marriage (however I fully understand others that chose not to, we all have our limits and lines in the sand, that goes for both sides). It is my personal value that I want to teach my kids to persevere against the odds, love is worth fighting for and if it doesn't work out at least I gave it my all.
We used to have so much fun and laughter together, it is almost like our children have inherited this but we have lost it ourselves. I am getting better at smiling but my Wife sees this as fake. I tell her that as much as a few months ago she was right, it was fake, most of the time now around our children it is real.
In past conversations she has brought up post-partum depression and even today told me she read that ADHD symptoms can get exponentially worse after having children yet so appears unable to align these with our relationship struggles.
I have been guilty in the past of not providing enough praise and I guess we have both taken each other for granted. I am more finely tuned in now and notice the small successes she makes and do try to acknowledge them. I have always praised her highly to others however not enough to her.
I have learned to avoid conflict too and this has made all facets of my life easier and I have learned to say 'no' more, instead of being everyone else's safety net.
One of my therapists advised me to drop all help for my Wife as I have spent my life throwing cushions under her to break her fall. This is completely true and in some way has likely molded her to who she is today. I have really tried to do that but my line is where it impacts our children and I e.g I do tidy up after her if she leaves the house in a state as we can't live in a certain state, but other things I am getting better at leaving. After all, we all have different ways of doing things and it is about reasonable compromise I figure. As you said, picking battles wisely.
I have also learned not to 'council' my wife or others and now am in a habit of either not giving unsolicited advice and waiting for them to ask or if appropriate I ask before sharing.
It appears that ADHD is cruel and has a detrimental effect on both the non-ADHD and the ADHD partners and both sides can grow with some empathy however I guess that is easier said than done.
Thank you for you input, it is much appreciated and fascinating to get both sides.
All the best
Love language dialect
Submitted by T00T00 on
My heart goes out to the both of you. I agree that both sides can grow with empathy.
I tell my husband: if I complain about something specific (i.e. I look ugly), can you praise/complement me (i.e. I look pretty)? The love language specified it as "dialects" which touches that specific person's heart even if you yourself might not feel it. My husband's is words of affirmation (i.e. I love you), but his dialect is what he specifically wants to hear (i.e. I love you when you are intimate with me). Yes, it can come across as "not enough" when the dialect for the love language isn't pinpointed specifically.
Thank you for your input as well. I am learning from your experience to increase my understanding & empathize with my husband.
Pain might have become trauma
Submitted by T00T00 on
I can identify a bit with your wife wanting/needing to heal (even though I don't have ADHD).
When the pain becomes trauma, it needs time to heal. The "quickest" time to heal oneself is by changing the environment (emotional cut off, physical separation, divorce, taking timeouts, doing self-care, etc.). True, there will be hardships going solo but it's super slow to heal trauma (especially heart pain).
Rebuilding trust will also take time especially if it's only in words rather than consistent action (aim for 1+ year). The relapse of the past (in mind, in thoughts, current action, lack of action, failures, no hope, lack of change, hard to break bad habit, hard to maintain good habit, hard to create new habits, etc.) might make anxiety, doubt, or skepticism prevalent in the current setting/environment.
Constant communication with each other will help a lot in transitioning. It's good to talk about how both of you feel and thought continuously. It's hard sometimes to change perception / way of seeing things.
Whatever decision the both of you agree on, I am keeping you both in my thoughts.