What do you tell your daughter...

...when she's been up all night, it's 4:30 in the morning, and without any word her mother hasn't yet come home from the birthday party she went to last night?



I have no easy answer, but I

I have no easy answer, but I can identify with how difficult it is to be in your position. My husband's behaviour was very rebellious a few years ago and our daughters did of course notice. I found it was important not to be dishonest with them - they could see that all was not as it should be or had been, so to candy coat things would have been negating to them - while at the same time not overloading them with too much information. I think those two principles were the best guidelines. I could certainly tell when I stepped outside of them: any sugar coating resulted in much eye rolling from the then teenage daughter and sharing even a little tmi resulted in a glimpse of fear in their eyes. I don't think they ever felt they needed to choose sides between us (I hope not). Then I tried to, non-judgementally but pointedly, let my husband know clearly the effect that his actions were having on our kids. Unfortunately it took a long time before he was ready to even see the consequences at all and then and only then did he make changes. But meanwhile I had to learn not to inadvertently protect him from his own consequences while I was busy protecting our daughters. Whew. 

And you remind your daughter that you're there, because you are, and that she can absolutely count on you because that's the aspect of the situation that you have control over. 

That's a tough one. I hope all turned out well for you.

Pbartender's picture

Vodka Pong?

"I'm not sure where mom is...  She was probably too tired to drive home, and decided to sleep over at her friend's house after the party."  A guess which was close enough to the truth.

She finally rolled in around 7 am, explaining that she'd joined a game of beer pong -- except with vodka shots instead of beer -- and was too drunk to drive home safe by the end of it, so she slept on her friend's couch.  She slept longer than she'd planned, and had breakfast there before she came home.

Now, I don't think what she did was a terribly good example to set for our kids, but I don't necessarily have a problem with it.  What bothered me most was that she didn't let us know that she was staying overnight, and so we ended up worrying about her unnecessarily.  She said that she thought it was too late by the time she'd decided, and that she didn't want to wake me up.  But she knows I'm up three or four times a night anyway.  A text message to let us know she was all right would have been enough.

It wasn't what she did, but how she did it.



Not Free Passing Bad Behavior Here

From the other side here's what I can tell you.

I don't know if you have an empathy problem like my husband does or not, but the point is I'm hoping to explain the other side.

I spent years compensating my husband's impulsive behavior n getting stuck with the lion's share of the grunt work.

It is finally time to reclaim my life.

Really, he can now compensate for what I need. I will say that if he can't adjust, I'm just plain not interested.

My personal suffering in this relationship was a non issue for him. It was all about his wants.

My needs were put on the back burner for so long n not even on his radar. He just kept going n going, often it didn't even include me unless it was an afterthought.

My advice is the same as a previous post. You hafta learn how to power through the frustration.

My husband's inability to tolerate the any frustration has been riddled throughout our marriage like swiss cheese. Let's just say that sinks a ship.


As the non-ADDer I get that

As the non-ADDer I get that sentiment for sure.  EXCEPT when there are kids involved.  That's when people need to grow up and do what's right.  I'd be ticked at DH if he did something like this and I'd never do it to him b/c we have a daughter.  

My Kids Are Much Older

They aren't little.

There's DD1, 19 n in college. The younger two are fifteen in about a month.

I don't actually go bailing out without telling the kids. No matter how many times my husband has done that to them n me.

However, unless I actually just get up n go, my husband will beat me to the punch by telling me five minutes before walking out the door that he's got some sort of plans, could be extensive n involved, say the whole weekend.

Perhaps your situation is different. That I do not know.

After what I've been through I just hesitate to fault the other spouse for being bold about wanting some "me" time.

I've been saddled with nothing but the grunt work and responsibilty for years while he was bailing out left n right.

Just sayin'.

Um... yeah... vodka pong....


Is she retaliating for something you've done?

My DH came home at 3:30 am once without calling or telling me what was going on.  We'd only been in the new place for a few weeks so I was worried.  I called him, and he was at a bar with his new colleagues. He made some remark later about 'now you know what it's like' to be the one waiting at home.

And, yes, I did stay out with friends til the wee hours of the moring.  But it was years and years ago, I was in my 20s, we weren't yet married and we had no kids.

Good news is, she trusts you with the kids... but... hm... 


Pbartender's picture

The idea had crossed my mind...

"Is she retaliating for something you've done?"

The idea had crossed my mind.  I've been running across a lot of...  oddities?...  that outwardly can only really be explained by her trying to exact some sort of "revenge" in what feels like a rather sneaky, passive-aggressive, petty, spiteful way.  Here's a few examples, so I can grumble a little bit about it and then let it go...

My wife and I are both fans of a particular science-fiction television show that barely ran for a season before being canceled, but kept a strong "cult" fan base.  A few weeks ago, I discovered that one of the temporary summer-student employees in our workshop this summer was also a fan of the show.  During a break, I logged in to Facebook to share with him an amusing photo and an article about the show that my wife had posted a few days earlier, only to discover that I couldn't see any of her posts.  Later, after a little investigation into my profile and security settings, I discovered that my Facebook account had been set to "hide" all her posts...  I noticed that someone had logged into my account from home, while I was at work and she had a day off, and she's the only person who knows my passwords.  I set it back without accusing her or saying anything about -- I treated it as if it had been a glitch with the website -- and a week later, after I had "liked" and commented on a few of her posts, it happened again but without any changes in my settings...  I can't be completely certain without stealing her password and logging into her account, but I think she put me on her "restricted" list.  I also happened to notice that her Facebook account no longer says she's married to me (though it doesn't say "it's complicated" or "single" either), and that I'm no longer listed on her list of family members.  Granted, it's all rather circumstantial evidence, but it's hard coming up with any other conclusion.

When she first moved into the spare bedroom and was talking about separation and divorce and such, we came to a few agreements...  One of which was that we'd do our best to remain friends.  The other was that we wouldn't "tear each other down" in front of the kids or our friends.  After she got home from her overnighter, she told me a story about how one of the guys at the party was poking fun of the birthday girl.  He meant it to be joking and funny, but he was a little too drunk to pull it off and came off as a jerk instead.  She told him off for it, and he pouted his way out of the party.  Later that night, I had some friends come over to play D&D (yeah, we're geeks that way... she plays too).  During the pre-game conversation, DW made fun of the fact that I kind of like mopeds and that I wouldn't mind having one for driving back and forth to work, she made fun of the horn-rimmed glasses that I like to wear, and she made fun of the fact that, even though she hates facial hair, I can't grow a proper mustache or a beard (It always ends up looking scraggly and patchy).  So, there she was, "tearing me down" in front of my friends for no real good reason.  Just like the guy she told off at the party the night before, I think she was trying to be funny about it but came off as a jerk instead...  Nobody laughed, nobody joined in, they just sat there looking uncomfortable.

Last night, after dinner with the kids (wife was working the closing shift), I sit down at the computer to log on the forums here and see what's up...  I start typing ADHDmarriage.com into the address bar, and got as far as "AD-", when the auto-complete drops down a whole long list of "ADvice" pages from Cosmopolitan.com.  Normally, this isn't something that would have caught my notice, except all the advice was about things like "How to Find Your Dream Guy", "Top 10 Things to Not Say About Past Relationships", "How to Hit on the Bartender", "Having Sex With Him for the First Time", "Workplace Romances", "Why Won't He Call Me Back?", "Top 10 Signs He's Into You", "How to Put On a Condom With Your Mouth" and so on.  Again, granted, this isn't really proof of anything.  But, all in all, while it may be a lot of good advice for a young, single woman looking to hookup with a guy, it's maybe not so much for a half-thinking-about-getting-divorced wife who's still harboring feelings for her estranged husband and might have a slim chance of reconciling with him if things work out.  It piqued my curiosity, so checked the browser's history...  It started the day after her all-night party, and she spent half the day yesterday browsing stuff like this while I was at work and our teenage kids were probably playing video games and watching movies on the other side of the room.

Eh...  Enough kvetching.  I could probably list more, but I'm sure you get the gist of it.  She says there's no hope of working things out, but to my face acts like there might be, but behind my back acts like she's planning on finding a boyfriend, and does it quietly and sneakily and secretly as if she doesn't want me to find out in case there's a chance we might stay married...  Round and round and round about.  (Okay, maybe a little more kvetching.)

I don't need to know details from her, but I wish she'd just be open and honest about these things with me as friends would be...  the way she says she wants us to be.  It's be a lot easier for me to move on, the way she wants me to, and a lot easier for me to figure out what I need to do, if I knew what was really going on.

Anyway... It also occurred to me that she might be trying to recapture the "wild and crazy" fun that everybody else got to have in their 20s, but she (we!) missed out on, because she married me and had kids instead.  She works with a lot of single people, a lot of them are in their 20s, and they seem to like partying in the typical college fashion.




crossed your mind...

Glad to see you acknowledge all the signs and recognize something is not right.  Doesn't sound like a really happy situation for anyone.  I have been separated for almost 20 years now and my new partner of 3 years (who had only been separated for a few months)  and I have had many discussions around what we each want out of a relationship and what it would look like if we found it wasn't working.  Seems like you are part way there.    It's important to make your own list of wants and needs and check from time to time if they are being met.  Information that is not being shared can make me crazy, I know that for a fact, but I learned the hard way, no everyone is the same or have the same comfort level to communicate. Sounds like you want answers, but someone isn't willing to communicate with you.  It's even more clear your wife has already left you.    Unfortunately the choice to me is clear after seeing your situation in black and white.  You have to take care of yourself and do what you want; even if that means leaving.  How long do you want to sit around waiting for something that may not happen.  State your case, set your boundary, and have the stones to make it happen.    Life is way to short to sit around waiting for someone else to determine our future.  Find someone who wants a relationship with you.  Life is not fair, and heartache takes it's toll on us. But it's worth it if you take care of yourself first. I spent 20 years in a relationship that held back the true me.  Now, I have met a great man, we sat down with our lists of deal breakers and we work on it all the time.  Luckily, it's been quite a ride .   Negative energy breeds a negative life.  Positive energy has the best positive effects. Good Luck! 

Happy at 56!


not good....

oh, boy....

red flags.  From the Facebook thing one could argue that she might just not want to have lots of posts from your friends on her news feed, but along with the 'cosmo' advice on the web history... it's pretty damning.  Either something is going on (my 'educated' guess is with the dude she talked about from the party) or she would LIKE something to be going on from what the 'advice' articles were about.


oh that sucks. 

Don't sit back anymore.  Tell her what you know.  Tell her you don't want BS.  Tell her what your boundaries are and what you're willing to do and or forgive in order to save your marriage and ask her to tell you what her boundaries are and what she is willing to do (if anything) to save it.  And really LISTEN to what she says so you don't get confused later.  Maybe even record the conversation or write stuff down so you don't 'remember it wrong.' (like I do all the time).

Mostly though, stay strong & stay with us, PBartender.  I know you're working through this alone in this from your other posts (which totally sucks also...) 

Ripping you apart in front of the other D&D geeks?   NOT cool.




Pbartender's picture

"Let it go... This too shall pass."

"Either something is going on...  ...or she would LIKE something to be going on from what the 'advice' articles were about."

Well, it's been almost five months since we last had sex, and an awful lot of the articles had to do with racy sex...  Despite her outward attitude toward me, she could be getting... *AHEM!*... horny.   I honestly don't think she's ever gone this long without it, since she hit puberty.

"Don't sit back anymore.  Tell her what you know.  Tell her you don't want BS.  Tell her what your boundaries are and what you're willing to do and or forgive in order to save your marriage and ask her to tell you what her boundaries are and what she is willing to do (if anything) to save it.  And really LISTEN to what she says so you don't get confused later."

No, I won't.  Sorry.  That's a sort of conversation we've had before, and it goes nowhere.  I'm not having it again.

Whatever these antics mean, it's time for me to do my best to stop worrying about her.  We have a year before either of us can truly move out.  If I can't let let this stuff go -- and venting a little about it here helps with that a LOT -- I'm going to go crazy(er) before then.

She'll make her choices and have to live with herself and the consequences afterwards.

I'll make my own choices.  I can be a better father, at least.  I can ensure a safe home for my kids.  I can be a role model for them.  I can work toward a financially comfortable budget.  And I can have a little fun of my own.

I still love her.  I still care for her.  I will always be here for her, should she change her mind and decides she wants to be a significant part of my life...  Even if only as friends.  but it might be time to give her what she wants and let her go.

I need to move on with or without her.  I won't go looking for anyone new -- that's not quite something I'm ready for just yet -- but I don't think I can sit around waiting anymore, either.

I'm tired of playing games.




Sorry - forgot you'd already had that conversation.

Oh, yuck, PBartender....  What a mess.  Hopefully most of the behavior and its meaning will slip past your kids' understanding.  They're still pretty small, right?

Get busy finding as much work as possible & get as financially sound as you can in the next year.  Be ready if the shit to hit the fan, because divorce is EXPENSIVE.

also:  get mad.  Show her who you are, and show her you will not be f*cked with or walked on. 

People talk about 'finding yourself' but, I'm learning now that you don't find out who you are someday, you have to decide who you want to be and bust your ass to get as close to it as possible.

In my case, I get paralyzed not knowing what the best thing to do is.. What the best plan of action or even what the best FIELD I should try.  Now i'm just 'taking a stab' every day an all directions til something sticks.  Gotta start somewhere. 

I'd avoid Vodka pong though....  and hooking up with other people...you don't need any STDs to make life even more miserable...

Even if you don't want to confront her about all the Facebook/Cosmo business, I'd ask her to sit down and discuss what you should tell the kids if she's out all night again.  Or set a boundary that she should at least text you and if she doesn't you call the fuzz.


Pbartender's picture

They're old enough...

My son is 14, and my daughter is almost 13.  My son is very highly functioning autistic, and so doesn't always understand why things aren't right, but he's very sensitive to emotion and can pretty easily pick up when something isn't right.  My daughter has the usual social and emotional hyper-sensitivities of an adolescent girl, and I'm beginning to have a sneaking suspicion she might have inherited up a bit of my ADHD.  They both know that we're not getting along perfectly, we've already talked to them about mom moving into the spare room.  I'm sure if they're entirely certain of the reasons why.  They're both smart enough and have been taught well enough to tell the difference between appropriate and inappropriate behavior, responsible and irresponsible actions.  They can see what she's doing, and while they may not yet understand the full implications, they can figure out for themselves that she was behaving badly.

"People talk about 'finding yourself' but, I'm learning now that you don't find out who you are someday, you have to decide who you want to be and bust your ass to get as close to it as possible."

I've mentioned in a few other threads that I've been reading a lot of Epictetus lately.  He says much the same thing:  "First say to yourself what you would be; and then do what you have to do."

"also:  get mad."

Oh, Ellamenno...  You're going to make me say it again...  No.  I won't.  Sorry.  I've seen anger "solve" problems, but in all my life, never for the better.

Control over my temper is one of the things I lost when my ADHD became prominent.  It was one of the things I prized most about myself when I had it.  It was one of the things I despised most about myself when I lost it.  I have it back again, it's made me a better man, a better father, and would make me a better husband if my wife ever gave me the chance.  I won't lose it again.  There are slower, tougher, but ultimately better ways to deal with this.  To quote Epictetus a few more times...

"Everything has two handles, the one by which it may be carried, the other by which it cannot. If your brother acts unjustly, don't lay hold on the action by the handle of his injustice, for by that it cannot be carried; but by the opposite, that he is your brother, that he was brought up with you; and thus you will lay hold on it, as it is to be carried."

"No thing great is created suddenly, any more than a bunch of grapes or a fig. If you tell me that you desire a fig, I answer you that there must be time. Let it first blossom, then bear fruit, then ripen."

"'My brother ought not to have treated me thus.' True: but he must see to that. However he may treat me, I must deal rightly by him. This is what lies with me, what none can hinder."

"It is difficulties that show what men are."

"If you have given way to anger, be sure that over and above the evil involved therein, you have strengthened the habit, and added fuel to the fire. If overcome by a temptation of the flesh, do not reckon it a single defeat, but that you have also strengthened your dissolute habits. Habits and faculties are necessarily affected by the corresponding acts... One who has had fever, even when it has left him, is not in the same condition of health as before, unless indeed his cure is complete. Something of the same sort is true also of diseases of the mind. Behind, there remains a legacy of traces and of blisters: and unless these are effectually erased, subsequent blows on the same spot will produce no longer mere blisters, but sores. If you do not wish to be prone to anger, do not feed the habit; give it nothing which may tend to its increase. At first, keep quiet and count the days when you were not angry: 'I used to be angry every day, then every other day: next every two, next every three days!' and if you succeed in passing thirty days, sacrifice to the Gods in thanksgiving."

I think that's enough philosophy for day.  :P 

On a more practical note, I refuse to get mad also because of this...

"Be ready if the shit to hit the fan, because divorce is EXPENSIVE."

When she first mentioned it, I did more than a little homework on that matter...  Divorce doesn't have to be expensive.  And it only really gets expensive when the divorcees get angry and can't peaceably agree on terms.  It can be done for a few hundred dollars or less and without lawyers at all, if everyone is amicable.



Getting 'mad'

By 'get mad' I meant 'get fired up' kind of thing....  Get confident, get strong kind of thing.  the opposite of both love and hate is indifference, so I guess what I'm saying is show indifference to the negative - the comments in front of your friends for example - and show strength, confidence and concrete evidence of your improved self.  yes, of course if you showed anger toward your spouse that wouldn't help anybody.

....and teenagers... wow.  Yeah, I'm sure they are picking up on everything.  Sounds like you're doing a good job though of minimizing the damage.

Pbartender's picture


I get what you mean, now...  It's exactly what I'm aiming for.

And there isn't necessarily anything wrong with feeling angry over something that justifies it, but we should be careful how we use and express that anger.



If she really is 'done' as

If she really is 'done' as you said before...there isn't much you can do about it.  From what you have written before you have been trying very hard it seems and you have been doing great. keep it up. be the best you can for yourself and your kids, even if your wife isn't. You sound like you carry your fair share if not more of the load if she can't see it or isn't willing to see it thats too bad. (wish my H would put in half the effort you have) however if she is still going to live in the same house with you and your kids she should at least still have some respect and behave appropriately, your children are not blind.

Good Luck PB

Cosmo only has articles of

Cosmo only has articles of that caliber. But still too many red flags. Facebook can be an awful place. I cancelled my  account after my ADHD hubby made some very impulsive, embarrassing comments.

Continue to be the best example for your kids. You're making progress. :)

Pb on my mind ...


Just wanted you to know that I have been thinking about you, and what we are both going through. I still wonder why my husband perceives me as rebellious, selfish, weak, dumb etc .... when I know with all my being that I am not. When I see your posts describing actions and behaviors of your wife, I can't relate to her at all ... I truly feel bad for your situation, as she is coming across to me in a negative way. I hope you remain open in your thoughts and heart, and try not to spend too much time focusing on negative thoughts. I do think negative thinking can alter perception and rewrite memories. That is the conclusion that I have come to in regards to what has happened in my marriage, as my husband dwells in the negative and is skeptical about everything and every one. I bet you know that if she was willing to try, you could make her feel like a fun-loving young adult again, and show her that the two of you can have a lot of fun together. I know my husband and I could have so much fun, excitement and renewed love in our lives if he was willing to try, but he isn't. I am beginning to question my beliefs and consider his words as truth, that I have lived a lie all of these years. If I accept his version of the past, I have to deal with knowing we haven't made love or been building a future together for all of these years. I have to admit to myself that he has denied me real love, affection, support, honesty and happiness in order to passively move through the years until our children were on their own. I have to come to grips with the reality that my marriage has been a fake for many years, on his part anyway. If he speaks the truth, I have been betrayed and I have been deceived into believing that he loved me and wanted to spend his life with me all of these years. I have given all that I could of myself for more than two decades. I am so much better than I have ever been since receiving my diagnosis, and I could be all that he wants and needs if he wanted that for himself at all. Everything that I thought I knew about my life and marriage has been vaporized in a blackhole of emptiness where my world used to be. Still, his actions and inaction confuse my heart and mind. I guess if he could truly portray himself as a satisfied and happy husband all of these years, when in fact, he claims to have been miserable, I can be confused by his acts of kindness now and his lack of action towards divorce. Enough about me though, I just wanted to let you know that I care, and hope she opens her heart towards you once again and tries to be a better woman for herself, you and the children. We both need our spouses to make some effort to save our marriages, but if that is not what comes of all this, we need to move forward as better people, without bitterness and a hardened heart, so that we can seek out new happiness and love. Take care of yourself and spend lots of time with your children.


Pbartender's picture

Huh... Wow...

"Enough about me though..."

Once again, you've written a post that reflects my situation almost perfectly...  Simply substitute me for you, and my wife for your husband.

She's said similar things...  That we never really loved each other.  That we've both been miserable for our entire marriage.  That she can't give me what I want.  That I can't give her what she wants.  So on and so forth.  I had (still am having, to some degree) very much the same thoughts and reactions about it.

Thinking about it...  To say that my wife had a troubled childhood, would be putting it lightly.  Her father ditched out before she was even born.  Her mother dated an ever-changing string of alcoholic, drug-using boyfriends.  They were perpetually poor.  From a very young age, she was forced to take care of herself and her younger sister in place of her mother, who was always out partying (sound familiar?).  And I only recently learned that in high school and college she was especially promiscuous with her own string on boyfriends...  Until she met me.

I'd asked her several times over last few years or so, during the times things were more worse than better, to try counseling with me so we could find a way to truly resolve our problems.  She always refused.  She said that she had been sent to dozens of counselors as a kid, she already knows what's wrong with her, and she's already dealt with it.  I'm beginning to think that maybe she hasn't dealt with it all as well as she thinks.

I've seen her be a kind, loving, happy woman, who took carefree joy in just being alive -- even long after we were married.  It's seems that, like your husband, she's talked herself into a "sour grapes" view of our marriage.  It's a shame she can't seem to look back and see it for what it was...  Both the bad times and the good times.  And we've had plenty of both.



PB - I'm sorry but your

PB - I'm sorry but your wife's behavior in my opinion was unacceptable, both playing Vodka pong, and staying overnight without any word.   What is she 19 ??  trying to re-live the past ? ....I don't know how old you or wife is but I haven't pulled a stupid stunt like that since I was in my 20's. I would NEVER do that now with 2 children...and my H would have called the police looking for me if I hadn't shown up home...thinking i was dead in a ditch somewhere.  Granted not driving was the right thing to do in that state, BUT she should not have gotten in that state and not let you know...how rude.  I know you are the ADD spouse and I have read most of your posts, but she seems to be behaving like most of the ADD spouses us non-ADD people bitch about.

My H drinks more than I think is appropriate, and I am always saying that its setting a bad example for our 14 & 12 yr old boys, who we often discuss the dangers of drinking/smoking/drugs with them...and yet dad has a few too many. If he were to get drunk and stay out all night, What kind of example is that ??

Pbartender's picture

I'm not against having stupid fun now and again, but...

"What is she 19 ??  trying to re-live the past ? ....I don't know how old you or wife is but I haven't pulled a stupid stunt like that since I was in my 20's."

We're both 36.  I'm not against having stupid fun now and again, but I think we're both old enough to do it with just a little bit of restraint, respect and responsibility.

My son and daughter are the same age as your sons.  We already have that sort of discussion about some of the things that happen in certain movies and shows we let them watch...  In the past I've talked to them about some of the things I've done, when I made mistakes.  I don't really want to have that sort of conversation about their mother, too.

"I know you are the ADD spouse and I have read most of your posts, but she seems to be behaving like most of the ADD spouses us non-ADD people bitch about."

Phew!  Thanks for confirming that...  "Doesn't anybody notice this?  I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!" - Jacobim Mugatu



PB, I'm really sorry to be

PB, I'm really sorry to be hearing all this. I know you were hoping for reconciliation. But if it doesn't go that way, watch your back. I know you want to make an amicable break of all this, but your wife is being totally inappropriate. And to be honest, it sounds like she will expect you to roll over and play dead during the divorce proceedings. If you don't, your wish will go down the drain. So in that case, you need to build a case because if this behavior persists, she doesn't need custody of your children. The fact that she is acting this way when your son has autism and your daughter is in a highly impressionable stage shows that she is selfish. You need to document your findings and take screen caps of these searches because if she's doing this now, there's a strong chance she'll do it once you two have divorced. And your children don't need to be exposed to that.

As an aside, I'm 30 years old and the worse thing I have ever done is take two Jello shots at a Halloween party two years ago. Not even when my husband and I were at our lowest did I pursue another relationship. My moral code forbade it.

I'm still pulling for you, PB. I hope that she will wake up and realize that your changing and this time, she's in the wrong. But if not, gird your loins, just in case. :-)

Pbartender's picture

It almost happened again...

I thought you guys might interested to hear this.

It almost happened again...

Friday night, DW was taking a friend out to dinner after work, about 8 or 9 pm.  Starting dinner that late, we didn't expect her to be home before everyone was in bed (the kids are getting ready to start school this week, so staying up late is out).  A little after 2 am, I wake up, as usual...  I hear DD, barely awake, fumbling around the kitchen getting herself a glass of water.   Again, she asks about DW, who isn't home yet.

This time, I sent her a text, "Are you still out with S-----?  I've got a barely awake daughter who's a little worried..."  She replies that they're finishing up soon, and then she'll be driving her friend home.  DD, feeling reassured, and I went back to bed, and DW arrived home shortly (I hadn't quite fallen asleep) thereafter.

Neither of us made a big deal about it the next day, but she did explain that often DD half wakes up in the middle of the night and climbs into bed with her.  It must have happened again and confused DD when she wasn't there.

Anyway...  Yesterday, she went to a going away party for a woman she works with.  We'd all gone to bed early-ish, but I know she came home before midnight.

It's hard to say whether the two instances are related, but I'm hoping she's beginning to see what sort of example she's been setting for her daughter.