The yo-you has started again?

So after almost 4 days of having my DH (almost) back to his old self - I fear that the nasty behavior is creeping back in.  So he was to drop one of our kids at a friends house to play (never been to this house before but its only 2 blocks away and I gave him the full address and directions - verbally twice and I wrote it down). My son calls not 2 mins after they left and asks where the house is? And two seconds later - my DH is yelling in the background (where the F^^^ is the house? There is not house # that you told/gave me.  I can't find it - Im bringing her home.) I give him the directions again/the house number again - the house has to be there.  No he insisted there isn't any house with that number.  Then he says, Oh never mind here it is. Click.   Really? Really?  Here is a man that can/has flown out to new cities and navigated his way around perfectly but can't find a house that is 2 blocks way in the neighborhood that he has lived in for 7 years? Really?! So he calls back 2 hours later(like nothing is wrong) and says it sounds like you are mad-why? So I explain that I there was no reason for you to blow up on the phone like you did - my concern now, is that the old attitude is beginning to start again (after 3 days without it)  His answer: your probably right (that he didn't need to blow up ).  Nothing else. Then when I see him 2 hours later, he acts as though nothing is wrong.  Ok, not a big deal - its just one thing right?  Wrong!

All day I have heard "i want to join a club (gym)"  "I can't wait to join" "when are we going to join" "Here's what I was thinking about joining" - ENOUGH!  We have had this SAME conversation for the last 3 months - the outcome - when I have a full time perm job we will join.  This will be happening by 1/31/11. I already saw the free joiners fee, we know the monthly fee, yes, I know how helpful it will be for you, yes, I know that you want to lose weight (again). ENOUGH! I have explained this to him at least 3 times - but he just won't stop! 

Then blows off our daily meeting (again - he did it last night too but at least we were together watching sports game on tv) So Im not going to remind him of our meetings - he knows how to tell time.  Im not going to chase - thats part of what I find exhausts me when I would chase him to talk, meeting, ect.  Since I have completely quit (expection last week) I do find that I am not as tired.

So needless to say, my fears of his nasty attitude and bad behavior seem to be making an appearance yet again.  Time to ramp up the plans for me.  Just reading my plan for obtaining my happiness helps me to regain my center and deal with the real issues and flush everything else.

I am wondering if anyone out here knows if therapy without meds works to make the positive changes?  Any and all ideas, comments, ect are welcome :)

So what will be will be.  I can only take care of me :)

How I would feel...

Situation #1 - finding the house. This is not completely uncommon for my husband. When you told him how you felt about his blow up, and he 'agreed', that would have been the end of it for me. I would have let it go. It doesn't make sense, there is no excuse, but to me this is just classic ADHD that gets them by the throat and they probably realize this as much as we do. Again, I think the more 'reactive' we are in these situations, the worse it just makes everything in general. For me (I know not everyone would agree) it is OK to sometimes just say "hey, he made a mistake..it is OK" and just let it go. I would be lying if I said I didn't have these 'moments' sometimes..maybe not to the same degree, but I am guilty of losing my patience just the same. The main concern I have in these situations is the children and the way they are effected by the outbursts. I try and stress the importance of this during times when things aren't heated.

Situation #2 - the lovely hyperfocus. I think of it this way...if I were excited about something and wanted to talk to him about it, I would want him to listen. I know how 'Energizer Bunny' like this can be, but I still make a huge effort to just listen. I would try and share some of his enthusiam...and just say "well, it won't be long now..just a few weeks!" For me, personally, it just makes me feel like I am showing him respect...hoping for the same in return.

Situation #3 - the meetings...as I said before, I would not let him blow these off. If you don't mention it, let it fall by the wayside, it will probably be the end of the meetings...and you don't want this. I guess you need to weigh which is more important..the exhaustive feeling of having to remind him or the damage done when the lines of communication are cut off by cutting out these meetings. There will be many aspects of the marriage that can be described as "exhausting" sometimes...it is what it is. Since poor follow-thru is a classic ADHD issue, to me it would be worth the effort to remind him. I don't have a problem AT ALL reminding my husband about counseling and such. Our marriage...well, we don't have a marriage without it.

I will give you the same advice I'm giving myself...and the same advice my counselor gave me...and the same advice your counselor gave you...DON'T FALL INTO THE HOLE!! Not sure what is going on with him, but the more 'reactive' you are, the worse it will be. Easier said than done...but it is the best solution. Keep your chin up, don't obsess and focus on him and what might be happening and focus on YOU and staying strong and focused on your goals to take care of you! (((HUGS)))

Sherri,  after reading my

Sherri,  after reading my post I realize that I need to be more clear.

Sit#1: Yes, I at times do get frustrated with little things.  My main concern is the kids and how this affects them. My son and I have had a really in depth conversation about what ADD is and all that can come with it and he was able to pick out those traits that my DH has. He is a very smart boy.  Now my daughter is under 10 and doesn't really get the ADD - she just knows when daddy is upset vs not upset.  And of course both kids were with him when he had an outburst.  One other point that I was trying to make was that since being off his meds he has gone into a deep depression to almost his old self (the first 17+ years of our life together) for 3 days and then the behaviors began to start up again.  I was hoping that it was the meds that were the cause of his anger - now, Im not so sure.  I wasn't trying to drag out the fight on the phone by letting him know that I was irritated and concerned - that was how I was feeling and I have a right to share that with him.  And yes, like you I do over look many things. Because like you said, we all make mistakes and move forward. But I also, feel that there are times when his outbursts need to be addressed.  One condition is the unreasonable and sudden outburst happening in front of the kids - is completely unacceptable. If he isn't called on his bad behavior what is that teaching the kids?  That its okay to behave in such a manner without any consequences?  Also, I know that his sudden outbursts tend to scare the kids - what a terrible things to do to your kids. And I know that is not what he wants to do.  So my intentions are clear with him that I am stating how his actions make me/others feel abt that behavior, the kids see that behavior (good and bad) need to be addressed and that DH needs to realize that his actions will affect his relationship with me and the kids. 

 

Sit #2: Hyper focus - yes its back.  We both were excited to join the club and found good reasons to do so.  It was a plan - it was set to happen in the next few weeks.  I reminded him of this - but he kept pushing - like a little kid.  To the point of where, I could no longer (1) be excited with him, (2) I explained again that yes we are joining at the end of the month when we have the funds to do so - it just a few weeks.  Go to the rec center and play basketball or something else until then.  I honestly feel that he trying to egg on a fight.  Then to find out afterward (the post) that he tried to talk some gym director into giving him a few free passes (which they declined - since he has already had some free passes just 2 months ago)  and then he asks do you think that they will give me a free pass if I tell them that I will join at the end of the month?  And proceeded to try calling the gym - they had already closed for the day.  Hyper focus in high gear! 

 

Sit#3: Meeting.  I agree with you Sherri - I could remind him about the meetings, how important the meetings are, and that this is classic ADD stuff. And last week I did remind him about the meeting after reading your post :) What changed now is that after my counseling session (Thurs) and explaining all that was happening the counselor said to stop reminding him of the meetings. We had been doing daily meetings long enough that he knows.  He expressed in the past how important he felt these meetings were and how much he was enjoying them.  At this point, DH should be able to handle the meeting on his own. 

What really gets me is that for 3 days he was so great!  Then day 4 these behaviors start up.  I was really hoping that it was the med's causing his behavior - I guess not.  

And yes, I will not fall into the hole.  Took to long to make it this far to see the light (for me).  It hurts to realize that he is really stuck and that he will not take any meds (he now believes that all med's are EVIL - his words) I am uncertain as to what chances we have to save our marriage at this point.  But this is what I know: I am okay with or without this marriage.  I am strong,kind, independent and forward moving with my life.  I am struggling with feeling guilty for moving forward - I don't feel that he is coming with me. 

Thanks Sherri, for everything. Your kind words and  thoughtful insight are always so helpful! I truely don't know what I'd have done if I didn't find you and the others here on the message boards.  ((Hugs))

Yes, in Sit #1 it really

Yes, in Sit #1 it really bothers me that the kids see this. I don't want to 'excuse' the behavior with the "It is just ADHD" either so I put Kenzie in counseling and I try and explain to her that no one is perfect, we're working on our issues, and I promise her that things will always be getting better. Before he started medication (or before the recent irritation started for whatever reason) things were amazing..for months they were amazing. She stopped complaining, they were rebuilding a relationship, and she was learning to trust us again. Now, she's having some of the same issues as before, angry all the time, and he's feeling like the majority of the problem is just her being a brat. We've agreed (he and I) to let our counselor help us deal with our daughter's issues...because I know we aren't going to agree at this point. I see irritation in them both, it is hard for me to determine what is caused by what. I need Dr. C's help. The kids, as I said in my original post, is my main concern in these situations. THAT is the one point he really needs to get about his outbursts.

In Sit #2..good luck with that. I know that once they get their minds set on something it is literally impossible to keep it from happening. My husband is like this when he sees something he wants. I wonder if he ever tells himself 'no' and just walks away from things. He'll sell his own stuff to buy something he has locked his radar in on...it is as if there is just very little ability to control the hyperfocus once it is happening. If it were my husband, he would figure out a way to get the money today to join...waiting is not something he is very good at...especially when the only thing standing between him and what he wants is a few bucks.

Sit #3..yes, I remember now that your counselor suggested you quit reminding him of the meetings. I can see her point and yours...and actually agree mostly. I sorta equated it with something that YOU needed and him not showing up was taking away from something you needed and that wasn't cool. If you're OK with placing the responsibility on him, then that works for me.

Was there anything in particular that was the 'start' of the end of his good mood? Did he just wake up and it was gone? Is this cycling in and out of good and bad moods common with him or is one more prevalent than the other most of the time? Right now, coming off of his meds, I might just give him some space for a possible 'crash' and just continue to take care of you! ((HUGS))

As far as the "start" of his

As far as the "start" of his good mood I can't remember anything - it was as though he just woke up and it was gone.  Cycling in and out of moods was very minimal on the meds - off the meds he seems to have hit a depression and then a "high" - I am wondering about bi-polar, which runs in his family along with depression and anxiety. 

Last night was bad - I reacted and so wish I hadn't but I have to say in hind sight - it was building and it came out.  So he left a message saying he was leaving work at 6 pm - he arrived home at 8 pm (its a 45 min commute) asks me what I did all day - as I begin to tell him he is distracted by the dog (yes, the dog) and then he goes to heat his dinner. He sits down and asks me how was work today? I say huh? He repeats himself again - this time my daughter chimes in "she isn't working now dad" and I just say "fine".  "Oh that's right I haven't switched out in my mind that you aren't working" I haven't worked in 2 weeks,  and he leaves the room to go onto the computer. So the kids and I are in one room he is in the other room with his computer. Where he stayed for the next 1 hr and 20 mins.  At 9 pm he continues to work on the computer. 10 min later he calls out "are we meeting tonight" I reply "its up to you" no reply. I wait 10 more mins and then I get the kids ready for bed - as I am taking them upstairs he says are we not meeting tonight? I said I was ready and waiting at 9 pm. "well I just asked you about it it was 9:04 according to my computer"  No it was 10 after and then another 10 mins past and no reply.  You blew off our meetings Sat and Sun night and now tonight.  "So were not meeting tonight then?" I was ready at 9 pm, so no we are not meeting tonight.  And I went to bed. He drank a bottle of wine, slept on the couch and took my truck today - NICE. 

Ok I admit - I handled this poorly. But as I think about it, he needs to realize that 9 pm means 9 pm - and daily means daily. If he had a business meeting he makes that a priority to attend on time and when scheduled without question. And that was the point of setting daily meetings - to make it and me a priority!  I allowed my frustration to get the best of me.  However, I will make amends, and I will start by apologizing for my actions.  And explain that I deserve to be a priority and when I'm not if feel disrespected.   Im guessing that its probably why the hyper-focus (its all about him) bothered me so much, too since he was blowing me off. So this fits into what you were saying about him not showing up for the meeting and that taking something away from me that I need - its true. I know this, but he needs to accept the responsibility of being consistent in filling that need for me. Which is what the counselor was getting at.

So back to his moods - I think that I am most concerned that I am seeing a pattern: he doesn't sleep well (a few hours a night), hyperfocus, drinking to much, then the anger comes into play. That is the pattern that happened last summer (when he was on med's)

Scene #2: (when not on meds)  very little sleep, isolating behavior, feeling overwhelmed and at times hopeless, drinking to much, irritable.

Guess there isn't much difference between on med's or not.  So anyway, I guess I'll see what happens from here. 

I had to chuckle when I read your #2 if he ever tells himself no and walks away - i have wondered that about my DH sooo many times - I think i know the answer for my DH. LOL!  So for xmas he decided to get me a present (that he wanted for me and that he know i'd want more than what I said I wanted) which now (that present) is just too much work for him to install and so now he needs to return it - no he doesn't have the receipt.  In addition he did buy me what I asked for - in the wrong size and the example of the items of what not to buy - and of course he doesn't have the receipt.  Of course he had no trouble buying for himself.  Needless to say I accepted all of this with a smile and thank you.  But here's the kicker - he thinks that I should return the gifts for him - really now?  He asked and i declined.  That didn't go so well with him.

Hope things are turning around for you and your DH - you have put so much work into yourself and marriage.  Hope counseling is working for you both. (HUGS)

 

I cannot see where you

I cannot see where you handled the situation so poorly..you just set up a boundary for yourself that he'll either respect from here on out, or he'll buck up and refuse to meet again and blame you for the lack of all future meetings because of you 'refusing' to meet with him last night. In other words, I think you did the right thing. What are you thinking you need to apologize for? If anything I would say "our meetings are at 9 p.m. If you need to be 5 or 10 minutes late, fine..just let me know. Otherwise, I will wait at 9..if you're not there, then that is on your shoulders, not mine" Maybe in a little nicer way, though? :) You can try and maintain your emotions, but you also need to draw some lines in the sand for him...and demanding the meeting be at a designated time and expecting him to at least show a tiny bit of enthusiam about it isn't asking too much.

I do not think you are too far off base with the bipolar suspicions...his symptoms definitely sound like it. Where would this leave you, in his treatment, if it were? Would he be willing to get help? It is my understanding that A) anti-depressants ..and sometimes ADHD meds..will make bipolar symptoms worse which could explain the negative changes in him since starting the meds B) bipolar must be priority to the ADHD and treated alone..because ADHD meds and bipolar meds do not mix well.

(HUGS) Sherri

 

also..

If he stopped his anti-depressant medication cold turkey, he could have a 'crash' period anywhere from 1-4 weeks after stopping. Might just be something to prepare for.

Sherri, Thanks for your

Sherri,

Thanks for your comments.  I see what you mean about the boundary - and I will take your suggestion and even the wording - I am convinced that he needs to hear the unsugar coated truth.

Now about if he has bipolar what would be my plans - well, I would like to believe that I'd stay and help him through it.  I can only imagine what life maybe like trying to get meds right (that is if I could get him to agree to try meds).  Honestly, the deal breaker would be 2 fold: (1) if the kids are affected and/or (2) if he didn't follow the treatment plan.

Its kind of that catch 22 - I married in sickness and in health - I don't really want to "cut and run" but at the same time if he isn't willing to heal himself I don't see much else good happening by sticking it out. 

We will see how tonight moves forward and if he decides to keep that appt for Thursday or not.

Thanks for you ear and open heart.

I don't know too much about

I don't know too much about it, not much at all actually, but I think the medications used to treat bipolar disorder aren't as 'trial and error' as ADHD meds..not that it is easy, but there are some fairly straight forward choices for medications. ADHD and bipolar are very similar in their symptoms. Maybe do a Google search for ADHD vs. Bipolar and see what the differences can be.

I agree, in sickness and in health...and I am in my marriage for the long haul as well...as long as he is willing to get help. Just like you, I feel that having the knowledge that something is not 'right' and refusing to do anything about it is not acceptable. I was more wondering what you felt the chances of him getting help for that were, if he were diagnosed.

I am praying that he keeps his appt for Thursday and that you start to see a reason to feel hopeful again.

((HUGS))

Sherri

Sherri I did google the

Sherri

I did google the adhd vs bipolar and WOW! Are these 2 similar (like TWINS)! Thanks for the good tip on finding useful infor about the 2.

 As far as the treatment  for bipolar (if he would accept it or not) I really couldn't say. The problem is that he knows that bi polar runs in his family but completely discounts it and the issues it causes. He explains it as a symptom of a medical incident - when that is so not true! But this is what he believes.  So I feel that he now has rejected the idea that the ADD is causing these issues in his life so to think that he would be willing to accept and treat bi polar is a long shot.  To be fair - he changes his mind so often that I can't keep up and his actions and reactions are so varied that I no longer can guess what he will chose. So the best answer I can give is what my boundary is for this and the consequence. As I stated before, as long as he is willing to work toward making life better (his and as a result our families) I am here. I will be loving and supportive and be there for him through it all.  This is what the boundary was for treating the ADD (this past late summer early fall) -consequence if it didn't happen/he quit - our marriage was finished.  (hence, this is where we are today :( and this same consequence has to be applied to a possible bi-polar situation.

As you know the night before last DH and I had an argument - we had patched things up and were planning (at his mention and request) to meet at 9pm  last night.  So after running errands with my daughter (son was at home doing homework and such) I arrive home with DH outside, son is inside and looks upset.  I ask son what happened - he tells me.  DH comes into the house and I ask him if he would like to tell me about what went - he says nothing, everything is good. Remember his need to have a moment to process the question- I asked him if he would like to have a moment to think and answer the question then - DH - No, everything is fine. We had a discussion - no big deal. So when I asked him if he used some really hurtful words toward our son he tried to explain it away.  Nothing doing - he actually said to my son "you are no good at point guard, you never have been and you never will be, and as the coach I will make sure that you aren't the point guard any longer."  His reasoning behind this was that he felt our son was feeling to much stress from that position and there are other kids that could play that position and let our son have a break at a different spot - what a bunch of B.S.  As my son put it; the only stress Im feeling is from you, dad. So anyway,there are SO many wrong/bad things in DH statement alone; its hard to pick a place to start! The words are so powerful (in a negative way) and controlling, intimidating and domineering -who IS this man? In any case, DH tried to justify all of this - yes, he really thought Id buy into his line of bull, and when I didn't, I explained to him that we all love him. We are worried about him. However, his behavior and words are powerful and hurtful and they need to stop now. No more "apologizes" no more explanations - just stopping this behavior! He said that he was going to go away. To where, I ask? DH - to florida. Why? Just to get away - yeah, I think I need to get away. As though a frigging vacation is going to help?????  I replied that if he was going away then it needed to be handled the proper way (explaining to the kids).  About 20 min later - I asked him if her still wanted to meet (9pm) - no - I think that we have already had are meeting for the night. And he went off to bed.  I have just about had all that I can take. I love him, I don't want my kids to grow up without there dad, you know that dream. Well, it may now just be a dream. I can't allow him to speak to my kids like that - he is tearing down their self esteem, setting a terrible example of what a being a man and husband and father.  What I am most afraid of at this point is that if we divorce there is no adult around to protect the kids from this behavior of his - I feel like I'm in a no win spot!

 

Yes, the similarities are

Yes, the similarities are unreal, but if you read the 'differences' they are fairly clear.

As for the tearing down of the kids, you have hit on the one issue that really is so important to me. My husband would never, ever be that blatant about it, he really is one of the "you can do anything you want" kind of fathers. My only issues are the fighting..and his refusal to stop when things were getting out of control. Also, his behavior had to be conducive to a peaceful homelife for our children...i.e. no drinking, no staying out all night, no fighting, and just setting a positive example in general. This was probably one of the hardest parts of his recent irritation..his 'attacks' on our daughter..that he refused to acknowledge. Even if he had a point or reason to say something to her, the way he went about it was ugly and sad. She cried for about 45 minutes after one incident, and because I said something to him about it..not in front of her..he said I wasn't showing him the respect he deserved. We have agreed to save this issue for counseling because we simply do not agree 100% on why my daughter has started acting out. I think there are several factors at play, and he just think she's being a brat. BUT, his attitude towards her is much better since we talked about it, so for that I am happy. She adores her Daddy. All of these kids need a strong father in their lives. I had a father that was 'unattached' and often critical of me...even though later in life he was a changed man and an amazing father...the damage from the lack of his support was obvious and I feel led me to make a lot of stupid decisions when it came to men and put up with a lot of stuff that I would have otherwise not put up with. I cannot accept this for my daughter. When we fight, she's miserable. It terrifies her. It rocks her to her core and she does NOT have the tools to make it "OK" for herself. I am not the kind to 'stay' for the kids, I am the kind to LEAVE for the kids. We are adults, if we cannot provide a home life for them at doesn't destroy them, then we need to go our separate ways, ya know?

He is targeting your son, for some reason....I've seen it 100 times....and I hope you can make him see this and stop rationalizing his behaviors with 'excuses' that even he probably doesn't believe. I pray he sees ALL that he is doing...soon. For all your sakes. My prayers are with you, as always.

Sherri

I agree with Sherri he is

I agree with Sherri he is targeting your son, mine targeted our daughter and still does. She is old enough that now that she can decide if she has to see him. She has two little boys, their father totally rubbed the husband the wrong way. He has tired to call her once since Xmas eve, didn't get an answer and didn't leave a message.  I don't know if it is because she is female or what.

We also have three boys and he never treated them like he does her. He did go off on the youngest last fall about having to take him to football. But it was more yelling, swearing that "She (me) needed to get my sh*t together if i was going to sign him up for stuff. Because he doesn't have the time to take him to anything".

As I said before the boys are so much different now that it is the three of us. We sit down to supper and actually talk! They play Wii games together, were goofing off wrestling and had a nerf war the other night even.

Sheri,

In all the years we were married there were issues, I would take them until they got so bad. Then I would give the ultimatum change or leave. He would change but it never lasted, keep in mind that until 2 years ago the ADD wasn't diagnosed. It was a terrible cycle which only got worse when I went back to work after birth of last son, lost over 50 lbs, went back to school for a degree. I wonder what he felt when all those changes were going on, do you think he felt like I was going to leave him so as a defense the behaviour intensified or he was mad because he saw me making changes taking chances and he couldn't do it himself?

 

Melly49

Melly

Were you and your daughter close? I think that my husband has always been a lot harsher towards our biological daughter and FAR too easy on my step-daughter. I have my theories as to why...but won't go into that now. One aspect I have thought of is that he was sometimes jealous that my daughter is 110% a Momma's girl (my SD and I have never gotten along). He has a lot of good points about my daughter and her attitude, but the way he goes about handling it is really cruel and hurtful to her sometimes. She is a LOT like him in that she does NOT take criticism very well, so trying to 'rationalize' with her isn't always easy..and even I get frustrated. She is 12...and has just recently 'become a woman'...and that isn't helping anything.

My husband makes these things easy for me to figure out because he makes comments here and there that give me a glimpse into what he's thinking..so yes, I would say your husband was threatened by your 'changes' and instead of doing the smart thing and jumping in and supporting you and showing you he was proud he apparently did the opposite and convinced himself you were somehow wrong to do these things, surely your motives were purely evil, and most likely he put up some walls to protect himself. That would be my best guess. For months after I started school, I would hear comments like "you're going to meet some smart guy and dump me" (he's one of the most intelligent people I know!) and when I would discuss ANYTHING school related, he would immediately change the subject and/or get aggrivated. What frustrates me the most is that he won't admit to any of it, but his actions SCREAM to me what he's thinking. Ok, so even if I'm misreading his actions to some degree, his refusal to even discuss it...or his keeping it all bottled up inside has, I feel, caused us a lot of issues. Of course this is completely out of my control .. how can we work through something that he won't admit is a problem? Instead of saying "I worry that you'll leave me" he just gets mad and grouchy when the subject comes up. His little comments here and there are all I have to go on, so I try to be as reassuring as possible when I get this small glimpse into his true feelings...and that is about the best I know how to handle it. When I went back to work, just to get out of the house, his insecurities went into overdrive. He admits that this was part of what 'pushed him over the edge' and I have made our counselor completely aware of this and have stressed adamantly that he needs to work on this because I would love to go back to work when I get out of school and take some of the pressure off of him as the sole breadwinner in such a terrible economy. I would love for us to have the extra money to travel and enjoy life a bit more. I don't want him to fall apart and worry that I will certainly fall in love with the first penis I meet...but this is something he has to 'fix' about himself. I could definitely see this kind of insecurity destroying someone if they ignored it or weren't honest about it...and the reaction, as I said, isn't at all in line with what they want...it is more in line with self-preservation at their (mistakenly) presumed future dumping. Just my theory.

SherriW

WOW your comment really made me have to stop and think. We were closer  "until she become a woman"..... that was when the bullying in school started to get worse. I would contact the school they wouldn't do anything, would ask/beg /push him to call and he would complain about it saying she needed to just "suck it up". That was also about the time we (she and I) figure the depression for her started. I remember calling social services crying trying to find out where to take her and they told me it was a stage. Nobody would listen to me that it was more then that. She finally got in for treatment after another students Mom read a note my daughter had put in a going away card and thought she was possibly suicidal. The counselor for that asked that parents and child attend some sessions, to say he was not happy nor a active participate would be mild. The Dr finally said "My goal is to get you graduated and out of the house, there is nothing else I can do" I should have stood up then and said this is enough.

When I went back to work it was in a preschool, not many single guys or guys at all were there. His behavior was to say the right things at first "I support you, I will help with house, kids etc." he always acted supportive around his family  and then turn around and say degrading things to me alone or in front of kids. My paycheck was supposed to be "Mad money" to take vacations, purchase things for family, fix the house up etc. Wasn't long before it was a needed part of budget. 

I will admit that live since I went back to work and school has been so full of changes. First those then the oldest children graduated HS and colleges, daughter had a new counselor that would come into home and after 2 sessions told him she strongly suspected ADD and depression in him (that was the last session he was at), birth of grandsons (our daughter is unmarried and he feels she should take care of her own damn kids with no help from us because the Dad and his family have very little to do with the boys), oldest son went to Iraq for 18 months (was gone 2 yrs total with the time training prior to leaving), he came back was engaged and married within months (that was hardest on me as he "dated" for only 2 months before leaving for training), I changed jobs a total of 3 times (first times were my choice to get schedule that had me home at times the boys needed me to be there, last time was because of corporate,  downsizing), he changed jobs because the company he was working for was slowing going bankrupt (they closed doors 2 months after he left I think. His quitting was at my insistence because he didn't want to have to face a change), his next job did layoffs during the downslide of the country, we had to move from home of 21 yrs into a rental, became grandparents again, he got another job in town (no travel!), diagnosed with ADD, heart valve problem, double bypass, COPD. During all this my daughter and I have gotten a lot closer.

He now always states " You always told be to leave and now I did but you are pissy about that. I don't think you know what you want". What I wanted was to have a family that actually enjoyed being together and a husband that had more then black or white viewpoints and didn't go from the extreme of sitting none involved with family to micro managing us.

After his last denial the other day of having ADD, I am done. I deserve to be happy , the boys deserve to be happy. He is happy with himself now so it is what it is. I am starting sessions just myself with counselor to  deal with the angry etc. I am feeling. I am not just angry with him but with myself for letting it go so long.

Melly and Sherri, Thank you

Melly and Sherri,

Thank you both for your reply.  Yes, he is most certainly targeting my son - why is unknown. But I have noticed that his behaviors are the same toward my son as DH was toward me this past summer.  I don't know if DH has decided to really hurt me (by picking on my son) or if he is just bullying someone smaller (not by much and not for long with how my son is growning) in size then him (DH)(trying to exert some sort of power).  The other thing is that my son looks soooo much like me I wonder if DH is using son as my proxy. 

I wish I could agree that DH has good points about the arguements with our son - but the arguements DO NOT make any SENSE! I mean really, I have tried to disect the conversations to find an angle where I could agree with DH but there just aren't any.  Sometimes, I think that DH is jealous of my son - he is a top A student, a natural athelte, well liked by peers and adults alike, just an all around terrific kid!

DH was a very encouraging father - so this behavior is so concerning. 

Melly, my husband has done that same thing to get whatever it is that he wanted. He would be angry with me if things did work out or if I said "no".  He actually admitted to the counselor that he KNOWS he does these things because that's how he got the truck. REALLY? Not so sure that ADDer's would admit to that - but maybe.  Just thinking about the major things over the years it dawns on me how much DH has controlled me with that type of behavior.  EX: moving across the country and back,  finally agreeing to purchase an item (set the price) and he spends way more without even letting me know about it, ect. The list goes on and on - I'm sure that many of us non ADDer spouses can relate to.

 

Well, my daughter does argue

Well, my daughter does argue with me over everything I ask her to do, tell her to do, tell her she cannot do, etc. It is a problem...but it needs to be handled much better than "do it again and you'll be sorry!" type deal. I have chosen to just let her stay at home for a while, not let her have many 'privledges' until she can make some changes in her attitude. I fully admit, too, that she is just a "Mini-me/him" AND that some of her anger could very well be a direct result of the hell we put her through. He isn't real willing to admit to any of this.

My husband's father made him a target as he got older too...and was so determined to make him understand his 'place' in the home, that for his 18th birthday he punched him in the face. He endured many years of criticism and "you'll never amount to anything" kind of comments as well. He talks about this VERY little...I've just heard bits and pieces...mostly from his mother. I really had some hard feelings towards her for a very long time for letting him be subject to that kind of abuse...and I think now that he's older, he does too.

He really is a good father. He is far more patient that I am, generally speaking...and he spends a lot of time with her. She just recently started to complain about him being 'grouchy' towards her again, after many months of her seeming to start to trust us again...but hopefully it was all just part of the recent issues and is going to work itself out.

She has been in counseling, as needed, since last Spring. She wants to go again..so I'm going to make her an appt when I go Friday. Our counselor just adores her..she's very articulate and LOVES having someone to talk to, who is 'on her side'.

Lonelywife40, I just read

Lonelywife40,

I just read this thread and it sounded so familiar.

Your question as to how he can navigate unfamiliar cities yet not find a house 2 blocks away. He probably does have issues with the unfamiliar cities but he is doing it for himself or his job so he deals with it however he has learned to. But for finding the house, he could call and "place" the blame of not finding it on you. Dealt with that many times.

The focus on something he wants at any cost, it is the attention span ADD/ADHD displays.  Been there I was on Work comp for over a year returned to work in Oct 2007. In December there was rumor that my position was going to change. He became focused on getting a new fishing boat during that time. About the time I found out basically I was not going to have a job by the end of January 2008 he had found a boat talked to loan officer and would call me daily asking me to go sign the papers and telling me that everything would be fine the payments wouldn't affect our budget. He was so mad that I refused to give him what he wanted, told me he worked for the money so he should be able to spend it.

 We had a counseling session to help the 11 yr old with the adjustment of 2 homes. I don't know how to refer to the husband since we aren't together but during the session I brought up his denial of ADD. The counselor pounced on that and went thru his file reviewing with him how the ADD diagnose came to be. She asked if he wanted to work on the ADD with behavior and she wasn't sure if there was medication with his health conditions. His response was "Nope not doing anything" response to why "I am happy how I am". He is well aware that no change means no us and he has a lawyer he is seeing this Friday.

I am truly to the point of taking care of me and the boys. Since he left the house has been for the most part calm (calm as can be with 17 and 11 yr old!).It is going to be a challenge with finances but it was when we were together also. I am scared to death what is going to happen but when I look at myself and the boys I think it will be worth it. The youngest came up to me several times just last night and gave me several hugs thru out the night! He goes and grabs the schedule right after supper and gets going on what needs to be done. It is amazing!

Melly49,  you have worked so

Melly49,  you have worked so hard to make these changes have a positive impact/outcome for your family - I applaud you! 

What I struggle with the most (recently) is that my kids do love their dad (even when he is at his worst). The problem is that I feel I need to be present in order to stop DH bad behavior and at least I am able to do this as long as we are living together.  Yes, I realize how distrustful that sounds - as a matter of fact, our counselor feels that I am overboard on this.  As I stated to him many, many times my kids are everything to me and i take my job as their mom to the highest level and always will. This is not anything that I will give in on or change. 

Keep the faith that the finances will work themselves out - as these things usually do.  It would be interesting to see the maybe things will be better (not running all the time to avoid the husband/fights, his over spending) - peace by itself is priceless!

Thank you for sharing your story - it is so helpful to read about what happens after the decision to end the marriage/relationship.

 

Update: DH decided to keep

Update: DH decided to keep his appt today. For this, I am grateful. So what he decided to share with me is that(1) he will be going to weekly meetings (just him) until DH decides that he is ready to bring me back in for our sessions (2) he will stay off his meds for the next month. Then he will start the Fluoxitine (prozac) and see how things progress from there (I thought this was very interesting) (3) he admitted to blowing off our meetings. 

Ok all of this is great. Here is the one sentence that took the winds out of my sail of hope- "And i told the counselor how we're going a club and he thinks thats a great idea.  Did you know that exercise is good for ADD?"  Why, oh why, did he have to do this? He wanted to talk more about joining the club then anything else! ARGH! This bothers me because I feel that he was more focused on the topic of joining the club than anything else about his meeting. I so hope that they covered more ground than joining the club and what exercise does for ADD - (BTW - DH has been informed about this fact over and over again; this is nothing new) I think it was his hyper focus in full force.

I am hopeful that he will be willing to share more about his meeting today since what he did share was things I already knew the counselor was going to do and the rest was really very surface stuff compared to what the counselor and I discussed. Im not sure what the idea of getting back on Fluoxitine is all about - or why DH agreed to it - and of course, does this mean that it will be another issue of him deciding to go off and on the meds as he wants?  I know, Im probably borrowing problems that I don't need, right?   So I would be interested in knowing what the reasoning was the made DH change his mind and get back on meds - because he told me never, ever again would he take meds.

As a side note, I received a call to set up an interview for a full time job.  Its looking pretty promising right now.